297724 Wed Jul 07 14:41:00 -0700 2004 17 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1643972 I've read about these things for years, and finally got one since the butter had melted in the butter dish on the counter this past weekend. Well, not melted, but it got so soft that it slid off the knife and glopped onto the counter (and the floor, which the cat took care of). The premise is that you spread softened butter into the bell part, put a 1/4 cup or so of cold water into a high-sided bowl, and turn the bell over into the water so the edges of the bell touch the water, forming a seal - for freshness and to keep butter at a spreadable consistency. And yo have to change the water every couple of days. Well, I tried it. And I found I'm not really liking it. The water gets on the butter, and while it's not a *lot* of water as it beads up, it just added more moisture than I wanted. Also, several times when I pulled the bell out of the bowl, the entire amount of butter was sucked out of the bell and fell back into the water...adding even *more* moisture than I'd want in my butter. So, if you have a butter bell - do you like or dislike them and why? I'm just not sure it's worth it just to have soft butter in the summer - probably easier to remember to take the butter out of the fridge about a half hour before needing it. Curious as to what others think about them. Link: http://www.ltremain.com/ Wed Jul 07 14:41:00 -0700 2004 0 Linda W. 1 1643981 I've had the same experience. After a day or so the butter (or a good portion of it) drops into the water. At first I thought it was the butter bell so I purchased a second one (different brand/slightly different shape). Same results. I have tried putting cold water in it, but the same thing happens. I've always heard others speak highly of this item so I just figured either I'm not putting the correct level of water in the bottom or it is just too hot and humid where I live although I do keep the house quite cool. At any rate, I finally gave up and put it away. I leave butter in a butter dish on the counter and it usually is consumed quickly enough that I don't worry about it going bad and if not, then I toss it and get a new stick out of the fridge. Remembering to take it out 30 minutes to an hour ahead of time doesn't seem to work for me.... Wed Jul 07 15:35:21 -0700 2004 1643972 0 LindaH 2 1644142 Wow! I can't imagine using a stick of butter quickly enough that it wouldn't need refrigeration! But taking it out 30 minutes to an hour ahead of use--that seems like it could be sitting out for hours including a meal, which would definitely mean it would need to get used up. My family was always spoiling milk by leaving it out all through breakfast before putting it away, so it never made it to the expiration date. Thu Jul 08 19:37:33 -0700 2004 1643981 0 Bunny-Bunny 3 1644173 We let it sit out for a couple of days before tossing it(usually not much left left if any)....never had any problems. I do keep the house quite cool but still the butter is soft enough to spread. I had a British friend years ago who did this and I always ragged her about it and the butter going bad. Then I read somewhere that butter didn't go bad(that quickly) sitting out at room temp. Again, we've never had any problems and it tastes just fine even at the end of the 2nd day. Now, I would never leave milk out on the counter - but then I prefer it ice cold. Thu Jul 08 23:27:27 -0700 2004 1644142 0 LindaH 3 1644203 There's a big difference between milk and butter. Butter doesn't have a high enough water content to allow for the growth of the kinds of bacteria that will make you sick. Milk does. So butter can sit out without danger unless it gets rancid - which you can tell by smelling it. Like any oil, this happens more quickly at higher temperatures. Milk that sits out at a warm temperature (actually, officially 40-140 degrees is the danger zone, but realistically there's a good bit of leeway at the low end of the spectrum) can go bad without even smelling bad and can make you sick. Essentially, there are two major ways you can get sick from injesting bacteria, either ingesting living bacteria which infect your body or injesting the toxins emitted by bacteria (essentially, their waste products). The first way is the more dangerous - you get sick a week or two later, and you can get really, really sick. That's salmonella, listeria, amoebic dysentery, etc. The second way makes you sick right away - you often don't finish your meal before you start to feel sick. In that case, the food usually smells or tastes off - though of course you might not notice if you're stuffy, or the food is highly spiced, etc. The important thing to remember is that the first way, infection, won't occur if the food is kept below forty degrees, for the simple reason that the sorts of bacteria that grow nicely in your body at 98.6 degrees aren't very comfortable reproducing in a chilly fridge. Other bacteria will grow at low temperatures and can make you sick via the second method, but, again, you can usually smell/taste the toxins. Also to remember, the ideal conditions for bacterial growth involve water, low sugar, low salt, low acid and preferably some protein, although the latter is not absolutely necessary - cooked rice and cut melons have been involved in cases of food poisining. Milk is a very perishable food in this regard: high moisture, no salt, no sugar, no acid, protein. (Oh, should probably mention, of course anything can transmit something on its surface - I'm not talking here about not washing what needs to be washed or not cooking things that can carry bacteria in their flesh.) But the above gives good rules of thumb for leaving things out - if they fit the above criteria, be very careful, and don't eat things that have been left out between 40-140 degrees for over two hours. If they don't fit the criteria (low moisture, high salt/sugar), you're probably okay. And if something fits the criteria but has been kept in cool conditions, it's probably okay unless it starts to smell or taste off. Fri Jul 09 10:39:46 -0700 2004 1644142 0 curiousbaker 4 1644285 Very informative - thanks. Fri Jul 09 17:44:36 -0700 2004 1644203 0 LindaH 1 1643982 I also thought it was a cool idea but have had little success with it. In one case, after about a week, we found mold growing on the butter---and yes, we changed the water but we didn't use the butter. My conclusion, after several failed efforts, is that its the sort of thing that works better in certain climates than others. We are in SoCal which is nothing like France [which is where I understand the dang things were created]. Perhaps they work better in other places. Wed Jul 07 15:43:12 -0700 2004 1643972 0 jenn 2 1644017 I'm in the Bay Area, and mine works just fine. Except once in a while I have to fish the butter out of the water, but if I smash the butter in good in the first place, that usually doesn't happen. Thu Jul 08 06:28:41 -0700 2004 1643982 0 Sharuf 3 1644030 Yeah, me too. And we don't keep the house cold in the summer, either...if the A/C goes on, it's only to cool the house down to 80 degrees or so. I actually found that *more* water, not less, keeps the butter firmly in the top. I found that the butter itself doesn't mold, but itsy-bitsy crumbs of bread from the toast sure are a good way to ruin the butter quickly. Makes a case for the old-fashioned manners of taking a portion of butter w/a clean knife and not double-dipping. Thu Jul 08 09:23:10 -0700 2004 1644017 0 --susan 1 1643987 As someone else said, they are made for a different climate, ie., France/Europe. So unless you live that far north, say in Canada, or you have the AC on, your home is probably too warm. The melting point of butter is 82.4-96.8°F (28-36°C). (Usually closer to the low end) So if your house temp is above about 75-78°F the butter is so soft and close to it's melting point that it will slide right into the water. The bell isn't supposed to be filled all the way with butter but to less than the depth of the water. Then it doesn't get wet. Also they are not made for long term storage of butter, just for a day or so. The butter is meant to be used not stored, and the amount the bell holds is only supposed to be a day or two's worth. Wed Jul 07 16:38:43 -0700 2004 1643972 0 The Rogue 2 1644033 The A/C definitely hasn't been on - it hasn't been that warm in the Boston area to warrant it. But neither has it been that cool. If the A/C was on, I wouldn't need the butter bell - a stick of butter in the butter dish would work just fine for me with continually running A/C. To your other points - the advertising claims that the bell fits a stick of butter (1/2 cup) and it shows the water coming up and around the bell - so I'm not sure which would be correct - your way or theirs. Also that it keeps the butter fresh for up to 30 days - pretty long-term. (Although I would easily use it within a week.) Again, I would suspect that it depends on the weather in your area. Either way - I returned it to the store. I'll just have to try and remember to remove the butter dish from the fridge before I want to use it. Thanks for the feedback, folks! Thu Jul 08 09:38:36 -0700 2004 1643987 0 Linda W. 1 1644014 I love having the spreadable butter I get from the bell. It sounds like your problem is climate. I currently live in the SF area and I have broken almost every rule, i.e., I filled the bell completely, forgot to change the water, left the butter bell untouched for a few days--with no ill effects whatsoever. But I would be very worried about leaving the butter bell in direct sunlight, or a very warm spot in the room. Thu Jul 08 01:54:05 -0700 2004 1643972 0 Pia 2 1644034 This was definitely out of sunlight - tucked under a ledge in my kitchen away from the stove and any light. Just the overall weather in my area, I guess. Thu Jul 08 09:39:30 -0700 2004 1644014 0 Linda W. 3 1644145 Seriously? I guess I'd missed this when I read the first post. You really leave butter out of the fridge for like days at a time? That seems kind of dangerous with a milk product doesn't it? Thu Jul 08 19:40:07 -0700 2004 1644034 0 Bunny-Bunny 4 1644283 Yes. Yes. No. The whole point of the butter bell is to not have to refridgerate it. See curiousbaker's explanation of the difference between milk & butter. Fri Jul 09 16:56:44 -0700 2004 1644145 0 Pssst 1 1644056 Haven't tried the bells but the butter boat that I purchased last winter is doing well in the first 80+ degrees days. You don't have to worry about flipping containers over into water. It's just a regular butter crock that has a separate container underneath to hold cold water. The water evaportates and travels through the boat (via unglazed portions), keeping the butter at a spreadable temp and preserving it for weeks. It worked like a charm for me over the winter. With warmer temps I find you have to change the water at least every day or the butter will become just slightly too soft. Adding a bit of ice doesn't hurt. Here's a source that includes half-sized ones, which suit my purposes more than the ones designed for a full stick. Link: http://www.qvc.com/asp/frameset.asp?nest=%2Fasp%2FIsItemNumberRedirect.asp&search=SQ&frames=y&referrer=QVC&txtDesc=butter+boat&Submit4=Go Thu Jul 08 11:58:20 -0700 2004 1643972 0 formerly grueldelux 2 1644070 Now THIS would work! Essentially a covered butter dish on top of the water/crushed ice. AND they're sold on eBay so I can (hopefully) pay a bit less. Thanks! Thu Jul 08 12:58:12 -0700 2004 1644056 0 Linda W. 1 1646935 That's too bad you didn't have good luck with your butter bell. It sounds like the room temperature was just warm enough to make the butter too soft. I've enjoyed ours for about a year now and have bought one for my daughter for her college apartment. I've told her to keep it on the table or counter away from a heat source. We live in Texas and keep our house in the low 70's temp.wise, so that is probably why we haven't had a problem. Sat Aug 07 08:54:49 -0700 2004 1643972 0 Ann