294032 Tue Sep 09 10:00:07 -0700 2003 25 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1611333 I have a serious case of potato envy. Just got back from a month in Lincolnshire, England, a place where potatoes matter. With most meals, at home or out, people serve a huge bowl of boiled, buttered potatoes, and a discussion ensues over the flavor, variety, comparison to other potatoes of this year and other years. Everyone knows whether they’re Ulster Prince, Pink Fir Apple, British Queen, Picasso, etc. And the potatoes taste great. People don’t buy them unless they taste great. Lincolnshire potatoes are fantastic. So here I am, home in upstate NY farm country, and the potatoes are all either “russet” “new” “white” or Yukon Gold. (And the so-called “new” potatoes are very rarely new—they’re just mystery waxy varieties.) Okay, McEnroe Organic farmstand has Russian Banana fingerlings as well. None of these has any flavor. Yukon Golds can be okay if they are kept right, but they don’t get near the flavor of English varieties. The whole Yukon Gold hype is just ridiculous—in the 80s all of a sudden American chefs latched on to this one, easy-to-grow, early maturing okay-tasting variety as a big deal. They really aren’t that good. And the supermarkets all wet the potatoes so they go moldy and leave them out in the daylight so they go green. Even recipes in American potato-oriented cookbooks just call for either russets or waxy. I’ve tried to grow my own potatoes from Ronninger’s seed potatoes—Kennebec, Yukons, Yellow Finn, and Green Mountain. Unfortunately I don’t have great potato soil or enough water to grow good potatoes. I’m stumped. How come even the good farmer’s markets and farmstands have cruddy potatoes? Tue Sep 09 10:00:07 -0700 2003 0 lucia 1 1611345 We get wonderful local potatoes in Los Angeles at a local farmer's market. The women is European and a little crazy. Rather than use "baby or new" she hangs a little sign that says "freshly dug" when they are in fact freshly dug. She grows flavorful yukons, finns, Russian banana fingerlings among others. The best is "la ratte" which is a French variety. We baked them at high heat in salt or covered in duck fat. Bliss. I wish we had more British versions as well. Tue Sep 09 12:23:37 -0700 2003 1611333 0 JudiAU 2 1611373 Which farmer's market, may I ask? Tue Sep 09 15:29:10 -0700 2003 1611345 0 Liloo 3 1611378 Hollywood- Sunday Tue Sep 09 16:02:54 -0700 2003 1611373 0 JudiAU 4 1611409 Great - that's my farmer's market. I'll look for her. Thanks! Tue Sep 09 19:47:56 -0700 2003 1611378 0 Liloo 1 1611375 Lucia - I'm so glad you brought this up. I was born and raised in the UK and really miss the wonderful potatoes of my youth. When I go back to visit I'm in awe of how many varieties are in the supermarket. Wouldn't it be nice to have more varieties available here in the US? Tue Sep 09 15:37:29 -0700 2003 1611333 0 Charlieboy 2 1611382 Charlieboy, Yeah, I'm sure decent potatoes exist in the US somewhere. I'd be happier if they even just labeled the varieties they do sell, rather than just selling them by type, e.g., Red Bliss instead of "new." I think US spuds have been rigorously bred to resist insects, blight, and drought, not to taste good. It's a shame. Tue Sep 09 16:29:02 -0700 2003 1611375 0 lucia 1 1611376 I think the clue is the consumer. American consumers have generally never tasted a great potato -- ever -- and generally consider potatoes a vehicle for treatments that mask the bland flavor of American potatoes (gravy, ketchup, cheese, etc.), so they don't demand anthing better. Even the organic farms seem to over-irrigate to increase the size of their potatoes. Can't exactly blame them; it's really the consumer's job to not buy things that are bland. I count myself as lax on this score, too, though I have greatly decreased the amount of potatoes I consume over the years. I even find McDonald's fries too tasteless to bother with; I'd rather have crispy tofu (and that says a lot!). Tue Sep 09 15:44:49 -0700 2003 1611333 0 Karl S. 2 1611384 Totally agree. On the other hand, consumers aren't given enough information at the store to know what they're getting. Giant bags of moldy green "white" or "russet" potatoes with digger scars are the standard. Where else but in an American supermarket can you spend over $100 on merchandise that is liberally abused by the seller right before your eyes? Tue Sep 09 16:37:15 -0700 2003 1611376 0 lucia 1 1611385 Last September, I read with interest Corby Kummer's article in Atlantic Monthly about "heirloom" potatoes from Wood Prarie Farm in Maine. I was intrigued but decided not to invest in the "Sample of the Month", fearing my wife and I couldn't eat all that we'd receive. I'm still considering, given that I, too, lament the lack of good potatoes. I attach the link to the article, which in turn has a link to the grower. Link: http://www.theatlantic.com/issues/2002/09/kummer.htm Tue Sep 09 16:49:49 -0700 2003 1611333 0 cinghiale 2 1611390 Hey, as a matter of fact I found Wood Prairie today--after ranting I thought best to be positive! And I joined for two months worth of sample heirlooms. Sept is the beginning of their season, so if the spuds are really good, I'll renew. So, I'm looking forward to my first shipment and will post results. My husband is on the moon. He spontaneously invented a "Potato Dance," sort of like Morris dancing but with kitchen utensils instead of hankies and sticks. For anyone interested, note that their Potato of the Month webpage promises that shipping is included in the price, but then they threaten to charge for shipping on the order form. A minor gripe if the tates are decent. Tue Sep 09 17:19:32 -0700 2003 1611385 0 lucia 3 1611412 They may charge for shipping because shipping potatoes isn't easy. Shipping is a prime issue in the potato quality question. I'm if I'm repeating myself since we kind of had this same discussion on this board a few weeks ago, but potatoes are very delicate and difficult to ship well. They are even difficult to store well when you grow them yourself. England is obviously a much smaller place and potatoes can be grown in pretty much all of it, with probably a pretty long season. I think our flavorless potatoes are the varieties that store well, ship well, and generally survive less than perfect handling (one local shop here puts them right in the window!). I just bought a bunch of grapes today that have, I swear, absolutely no flavor whatsoever. The few I got off my own vines were so intensely flavored I could only eat one at a time. The ones of mine that made it to the kitchen didn't survive a few hours on the counter before they became mushy. Great flavor, no storing, same problem. Tue Sep 09 20:02:57 -0700 2003 1611390 0 BB 3 1611439 i will pay good money to see your husband do his potato dance!!! i want to learn a potato dance!!!! Wed Sep 10 07:48:13 -0700 2003 1611390 0 kiki aru 4 1611441 Well, the Mashed Potato was a classic dance of the early 60s, wasn't it? Wed Sep 10 08:02:18 -0700 2003 1611439 0 Karl S. 3 1611456 Just confirming that Wood Prairie does not charge shipping on the spud club orders. Wed Sep 10 10:41:19 -0700 2003 1611390 0 lucia 1 1611386 Have you looked on the internet? A quick Google search for "gourmet potatoes" brought up lots of promising looking links, including the one linked below. (You know, better to light a candle...) Link: http://www.sweetgrassfarms.com/potatoes.htm Tue Sep 09 16:58:16 -0700 2003 1611333 0 David Kahn 1 1611389 Quite a rant. I'm not sure I agree though. Sure, maybe we as a group don't take potatoes very seriously, but we don't do a lot with kidney pie either. Likewise, we have many foods here which are not taken so seriously in the UK. I'd attribute much of it to regional, or in this case international differences in tastes. Good potatoes can be had here, but like many fruits and vegetables you have to seek them out beyond your local supermarket. As for your comment that "the supermarkets all wet the potatoes ", well, I've never ever seen a supermarket "wetting" their potatoes. I guess they may get some condensation if they come from refrigeration to more humid warmer air, but I can't imagine what the purpose of wetting them sould be? Tue Sep 09 17:14:09 -0700 2003 1611333 0 AlanH 2 1611400 "Sure, maybe we as a group don't take potatoes very seriously, . . " I guess I take potatoes as seriously as I take tomatoes or fish or chocolate or pie, or as seriously as someone else takes potato chips or hamburgers. I think its a shame that something consumed in such vast quantities has reached such a low point in quality. I'm sure there are foods that you, too, "take seriously." Isn't that what this site is about? BTW, I shop for most of my vegetables, including potatoes, at local farmstands at this time of year, at the same farms that supply the NYC Greenmarkets. Mostly the quality of produce is very good. Potatoes are the unfortunate exception. And, as you can read in the Atlantic Monthly article cinghiale kindly provided, it's standard industry procedure to wash all commercial potatoes, although this promotes rot and premature aging. They are often damp and in plastic bages when on the supermarket shelves. Tue Sep 09 18:17:53 -0700 2003 1611389 0 lucia 3 1611437 having spent part of July and all of August in either the UK or France this summer I have to strongly agree about the potatoes. We were on a farm in the gascgone region of France and had some potatoes that were grown by a neigbor = unbelievable and nothing heirloom about them. They were so sweet and fluffy. Ditto the fresh tomatoes my niece was growing in her garden plot no special variety but incrediblely delicious and this was a bad summer for them too much heat and not enough rain. Cut back to the Union Square farmers market here in NYC. The tomatoes have been generally dissappointing this year or maybe its just the comparision to Europe I dont know but I bought a case of red and yellows last week for a party I was doing on Saturday and found them to be generally blah. On the positive side the cherry tomato varieties were very sweet but cherries do tend to be sweet anyway... I was sorely dissappointed with the tomato purchase back to the potato issue, I think from experience, the potatoes in the UK are generally better than here anyhow. And that includes plain jane supermarket varieties as well as speciality markets such as Borough Market sources. Wed Sep 10 02:20:54 -0700 2003 1611400 0 tigerwoman 1 1611406 Two weeks ago I wouldn't have understood what you were talking about, and pointed to the selection of fingerlings and others varieties at the farmers market. But I was just in England for ten days and I had the best potatoes in my life. Now I didn't expect to get blown away by a potato but it was in fact the most memorable food experience in some time. I had dinner at Conrad's Bluebird in London and while the pre fixe meal was good , I ordered a side of Jersey Royals and fought with my girlfriend over who was going to finish them. They were simply boiled with some mint and then buttered up. simple and the flavor was amazing. All I can say to folks is that you'd know it when you taste it. Tue Sep 09 19:16:37 -0700 2003 1611333 0 SLAP 1 1611418 I tried to make everyone aware of what was wrong about our retail potatoes on Augest 17th, but wasn't able to provide a "URL" referance for this posting, as it wasn't available via chowhound or I did something wrong, so sorry guess you'll have to scroll. It seems to me that potaoes are expensive enough, with some varieties going to over $ 2.00 per pound, then to be made to pay a additional premium for shipping and packing. I've been buying and tasting organic, farm raised, farmers markets. etc, and except for so called "Spuds", available from some local growers in 50 or 100 pound bags, used for local restaurants [Seattle] for French Fries or whatever, I haven't been able to obtain a potatoey taste, and with a family of 2 by the time i'm only part way thru a 50 pound bag, they've started to sprout. Irwin Tue Sep 09 21:08:06 -0700 2003 1611333 0 Irwin Koval 2 1611440 See link Link: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/show/293822#1609473 Wed Sep 10 07:58:20 -0700 2003 1611418 0 Marty L. 1 1611432 I also look forward to English potatoes, but I always thought that they simply cooked them with more care than Americans did. (The Irish have been known for great potatoes for an awfully long time.) I wonder if Americans are simply careless about potatoes? I know I'm not careful! Maybe I should be? The Maine potatoes in September seem pretty good to me, to be fair. Tue Sep 09 23:19:11 -0700 2003 1611333 0 bunnyr 1 1611457 Totally agree. Where's the restaurant that can take the potato and make it the gourmet item it deserves to be. Even at the 'top' restuarants we typically only see 'Fingerling' highlighted, without any indication of which one (and some are better for boiling, others for baking etc). I recall reading on a Govt website for New Brunswick that over 250 different varieties of potato were grown in the province. I presume it's similar for Maine. What happens to them? Wed Sep 10 10:48:26 -0700 2003 1611333 0 estufarian 1 1611506 Part of the problem here is that growing conditions in England and northern France are just about perfect for potatoes, at least in terms of flavor. The best potatoes in North America are grown in Canada, or in those parts of the U.S. with a climate most resembling England, like Maine. However, in those places, unlike in England, there is a prolonged hard freeze most winters, and growing seasons are quite short and unpredictable, so yields are quite low. Otherwise, given the amounts needed to serve supermarket-shopping Americans, and the financial structure of American agriculture, most potatoes are grown where the yields are the highest, the production costs the lowest, and the weather as predictable as possible. This means bland standardized potatoes, which, as pointed out earlier, most Americans use as a "base" for other food flavors. I truly miss the Canadian potatoes of my youthful summers... Wed Sep 10 15:26:43 -0700 2003 1611333 0 Detroit-NYC Al 1 1611553 Was in PEI again this summer and had serious potato-envy of the spuds you get there. Reminds me so much of Ireland, where potatoes are close to religion. I smuggled a bag of those PEI beauties back with me and have enjoyed them every way, but none better than simply boiled and served with butter. Yum yum. Wed Sep 10 22:05:34 -0700 2003 1611333 0 yumyum