288625 Sun Mar 03 07:16:47 -0800 2002 29 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1558194 Our second quart bottle of Cosco catsup has darkend. My wife refuses to consume it with me. She has her own small bottle of bright red catsup. So many solutions are obvious, I find it confusing. Someone, set me straight. Sun Mar 03 07:16:47 -0800 2002 0 Wylie 1 1558198 Well, I think that it is perfectly ok to eat. Catsup has lots of vinegar in it. I think that if it were bad, it would smell bad. That being said, I'm with your wife. I wouldn't eat it either. Sun Mar 03 07:22:06 -0800 2002 1558194 0 Kim Shook 2 1558208 Ketchup (you spell catsup I spell ketchup... it's all good) goes dark due to oxidation. ie., the contents react to air after opening. This slowly leads to the flavors declining and getting "off" tastes. But the oxidation can be a clue that the item has also been exposed to bacteria and is going "bad." That said, taste it. If it tastes good eat it. Usually the high vinegar level in ketchup keeps it good for a long time. I hate cold ketchup on food and keep opened bottles in the pantry, they darken if not used quickly but I havn't noticed a bad taste. I sometimes think that it may even taste Better due to a bit of maturing. J. Forester Sun Mar 03 08:00:39 -0800 2002 1558198 0 The Rogue 3 1558227 The trick is to have someone under about 25 in the house. Then you can keep the bottle in the pantry as opposed to the frige and not worry about it turning dark, because it will be used on every conceivable and inconceivable food and disappear before oxidation has time to take hold. Sun Mar 03 13:55:57 -0800 2002 1558208 0 Chino Wayne 4 1558231 I have gotten in the habit of taking my warm and starting to darken ketchup (I hate cold ketchup on food, it tastes different than when warm and chills the food) and sticking it in the fridge and opening a new bottle for myself, that way my neices and nephew will kill off the cold nasty ketchup within a day or so when they come to visit. The youngun's do have their uses, too bad that their parents won't let me help them develop into chow pups. All they seem to eat is vanilla ice cream, hot dogs (doused with ketchup- Ghastly! No self respecting dog would be seen in anything less than Nathan's mustard) and kraft mac n cheez, ugh! PS. I say Ta Ma Toe Sun Mar 03 14:28:23 -0800 2002 1558227 0 The Rogue 5 1558237 We had a couple of foster kids for about six months once. When I would come home from work and kill myself to put a decent, well balanced meal, with real food on the table, the "little darlings" would refuse to eat it. It got to the point that all they would eat was some nasty kids TV dinner crap. Ketchup was a big part of their diet also. For various reasons, including maintaining our sanity and our marriage, the wife and I turned in the kids and adopted a cat. The cat has turned out to be a wonderful addition to the family. Its just that the wife caters to the cat with multiple buffets of various and sundry dry and wet food in at least three locations throughout the house. But at least he usually eats what we feed him. Sun Mar 03 16:25:57 -0800 2002 1558231 0 Chino Wayne 6 1558240 I had a very cool cat, Rusty, as a teen. Much more cool than my non-chow pup nieces and nephew, although my mother spoiled him as bad as she does her grandkids now. In addition to his wet and dry veterinarian approved food the cat was fed perfectly cooked shrimp and tuna packed in spring water. I rarely got any of the shrimp cocktail but man did that cat revel in it. The cat also liked to go out cruizin' in my hot rod. He was a people cat and liked to get around to all the happenin' scenes and parties. He would wait on the hood of my car and hop inside as soon as the door opened. He would then take his place on the back deck and watch everything from the rear window. He hated the window tinting and scratched it so bad I had to remove it for him to see out. People thought he was a stuffed animal until he moved or stretched then ya just had to see the expression on their faces. He was a real party animal and loved beer. He would knock over your can if you left it unattended and take possesion of it, sipping every now and then. Forget about holiday eggnog, you had to lock him up when the punch bowl was out or he would practically climb in. Fun to watch, but you ever have to deal with a twenty pound drunk and raucous cat? He was great for meeting the ladies, a real tomcat. If they didn't come over to say hi he would take it upon himself to introduce him and us to all and sundry. Boy do I miss him. He sure made life easy. After that I had a wild baby unscented skunk (Rozanne) that would eat almost anything but loved grapes, good cheese, and pate mouse with truffles like nobodies business. She rode around on my shoulders wrapped around my neck with her nose peeking out from my hair on one side and her tail on the other, looking like a skunk muffler. She was also one who liked a beer every now and then. Anyone else have any Chow Pets? JMF Sun Mar 03 16:52:53 -0800 2002 1558237 0 The Rogue 7 1558248 Rusty sounds like a very cool cat. Binky would like to have known Rusty. Binky owns our house and everything in it. Every once in a while I catch the wife feeding The Binkster scraps from the table. He loves french fries and baked ham. He is very smart too, he trained the wife to feed him cat treats when ever he scratches the dresser in the bedroom. Now I am having to retrain them both. And a skunk, oh man you are a real cool cat. Ever heard of Jerry Dragoo. He is one of the formest skunk experts in the United States. Link: http://www.dragoo.org/ Sun Mar 03 18:58:27 -0800 2002 1558240 0 Chino Wayne 8 1558250 I seem to have a thing for weird pets and animals are attracted to me... sometimes more than I like. I used to work about 100 days a year in the wilderness for many years as an Outward Bound instructor. During that time I once woke up with a racoon sitting on my chest eating my gorp. Never fall asleep eating gorp when you are not in a tent! I have had a family of skunks cuddle up to me in the middle of the night for warmth during a freak summer snow storm. I had a female bear that thought I was a studly male bear, she followed me around for months and would break in to my cabin and wake me up at 6am by taking my wrist in her mouth. She loved to chow down on my beef jerky and other munchies too. I once had 167 pets of 30 species in a townhouse in florida. It was so funny to see a dog, 4 cats, an african gray parrot, a cockatoo, and two 4-5 ft long iguanas all eating out of the same food bowl and gently pushing each other out of the way. All of those guys loved bananas and peanut butter so much that you couldnt eat one in the house without sharing with all. Sun Mar 03 19:55:48 -0800 2002 1558248 0 The Rogue 9 1558257 WOW! You seem to be one of those special people that attract animals, very cool. Isn't it interesting that in the animal kingdom all those different species seem to be able to get along ok, (prey and predators are another story) humans ought to take a lesson from it. Sun Mar 03 22:39:29 -0800 2002 1558250 0 Chino Wayne 9 1558261 Hey JMF Just wondering if you've ever read "A Walk In The Woods" by Bill Bryson...somehow I think you'd enjoy it! Highly recommended! Sun Mar 03 23:32:15 -0800 2002 1558250 0 Brook 10 1558278 Thanks... No but I will check it out. Jonathan Mon Mar 04 10:45:37 -0800 2002 1558261 0 The Rogue 9 1558262 Everyone loves a rogue:) Sun Mar 03 23:37:51 -0800 2002 1558250 0 saucyknave 9 1558275 You need to meet my Mom-from whom I received my love for food. She's like a freaking pied piper when it comes to wild animals in trouble. Racoons, pigs (not Viet Pot Belly), wild starlings, squirrels have all come to be rehabbed at mom's acre. Mon Mar 04 10:06:43 -0800 2002 1558250 0 Tater 7 1558387 Please share your recipe for "pate mouse". Sounds like something my cat would love. Wed Mar 06 08:26:18 -0800 2002 1558240 0 Tom Meg 8 1558393 Just the commercial stuff that goes for $14-20 a lb. Just ask for Pate Mouse with truffles at any pate / cheese shop or good grocery store. But why waste it on your cat? Wed Mar 06 09:41:21 -0800 2002 1558387 0 The Rogue 9 1558423 "Why waste it on your cat?" Because he thinks he owns this house and everything in it, and I wanna stay on his good side... Wed Mar 06 13:29:12 -0800 2002 1558393 0 Chino Wayne 10 1558436 Yeah, Yeah, I Know... but you have to at least TRY to assert your independance. You won't be fooling your cat but it makes you feel better. that is until your cat sticks his butt in your nose and your face gets used as a pillow in the middle of the night. Wed Mar 06 14:26:25 -0800 2002 1558423 0 The Rogue 11 1558478 Spoken like a true posession of a cat... Wed Mar 06 20:13:17 -0800 2002 1558436 0 Chno Wayne 12 1558480 I am not posessed at this time. A long sucession of cats got fed up with me borrowing, and then using up, all their lives. Now I just tell tall tales about it all... Wed Mar 06 20:50:08 -0800 2002 1558478 0 The Rogue 8 1558398 Hehe. Mine too. Wed Mar 06 10:06:38 -0800 2002 1558387 0 ironmom 6 1558244 My husband and I both *love* to cook. I've told my chillens that we do NOT cook for them, but they are welcome to eat whatever we cook. If they don't want to eat what we serve, they're welcome to fix something for themselves. However, they may NOT use heat (including the microwave). So, they can have cold cereal, PBJ, and not much else. Needless to say, they usually choose what we have. And are turning into grand little chowhounds! But I guess you can't be that mean to foster kids!!!! Sun Mar 03 18:07:07 -0800 2002 1558237 0 cjb 3 1558266 I wonder if oxidation is the only reason it darkens? I had two unopened bottles of Heinz ketchup in my cupboard; one was dark and one was light. Mon Mar 04 00:54:19 -0800 2002 1558208 0 Wendy Leonard 4 1558277 I e-mailed Heinz about color and taste variations including oxidation and natural manufacturing possibilities and will post their response, if any, when it arrives. I am curious what they will have to say. Jonathan Forester Mon Mar 04 10:21:25 -0800 2002 1558266 0 The Rogue 1 1558217 Assuming the catsup isn't poisonous yet, it's a matter of esthetics. I was an art major, so I'd toss it. Sun Mar 03 12:45:18 -0800 2002 1558194 0 Sharuf 1 1558323 Here is a copy of a email I sent to Heinz and their response: Date: 3/4/2002 4:06:37 PM Eastern Standard Time From: Michael.Mullen@hjheinz.com Sent from the Internet (Details) I received a copy of your email below. Thanks for contacting Heinz. Heinz Ketchup is the world's most popular ketchup selling more than 300 million bottles annually in the U.S. alone. Regarding your questions: Any food product's color will be altered slightly after it is exposed to air There is no variation in color in Heinz Ketchup. It has a thick, rich, red color. Again, there is no variation in the taste of Heinz ketchup nationwide. The product is produced with many quality checks to ensure every drop tastes the same. I hope this answers your questions. Thanks. Michael Mullen Communications Department Heinz North America Heinz 57 Center, 9th Floor 357 6th Avenue Pittsburgh, PA 15222 Phone: 412-237-3562 Fax 412-237-5776 Pager 412-272-2262 -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 10:17 AM To: husa.consumeraffairs@husa.com Subject: Heinz "Contact Us" Inquiry Subject = Product Information Comment = I have some ketchup questions for a food discussion board website. www.chowhound.com 1. Why does the ketchup go dark after opening? Is it oxidation or other reasons? 2. Sometimes there is a variation of color (darker vs. lighter) among unopened bottles. Is this just natural color variations or the result of oxidation due to a poor bottle seal? 3. I notice taste variations upon occasion.(sometimes milder taste and sometimes spicier) Is this natural recipe blend variations or some other reason. PS. I like the slightly more acidic and spicier bottles of Heinz ketchup than the sweeter less flavorful. If it is a possible recipe variation do you think you may eventually market a more "robust" version that isn't hotter like the Tobasco version but just a bit more of the traditional spices. Sincerely, Jonathan Forester Food Writer Business Consultant Psychotherapist Executive / Corporate Coach NYS Licensed Wilderness Guide Mon Mar 04 19:11:55 -0800 2002 1558194 0 The Rogue 2 1558327 Rogue- Your respondent sounds like a standard corporate mouthpiece. Did not really answer your questions, just put out the party line. I think I read somewhere recently that Heinz was going to market ketchup in differernt colors (like blue, etc.) in opage bottles in selected markets and see what the response will be. They ought to realize they should not mess with a classic, nor be trying to fool Mother Nature. Mon Mar 04 20:17:49 -0800 2002 1558323 0 Chino Wayne 3 1558329 They (Heinz) already market both green and now purple ketchup. Mon Mar 04 21:45:18 -0800 2002 1558327 0 Caitlin McGrath 2 1558331 Oh brother. Next time I have a dark bottle I'll sternly tell myself that it's that same rich, thick, red color... Mon Mar 04 22:06:49 -0800 2002 1558323 0 Wendy Leonard 2 1559194 I've seen a pbs short documenting how Heinz ketchup is made, I forgot name of show, but basically there was one person (kind of like the brewmaster in a brewery) whose job was to load in the ingredients, cook it, taste the outcome, and adjust the seasonings before having it bottled. Sat Mar 16 05:57:40 -0800 2002 1558323 0 sooth