287978 Wed Nov 28 13:50:36 -0800 2001 48 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1551942 The next 12 weeks are my favorite for sucking down the seasonal suds. I'd like to get an early chat going on what highlights and personal favs are available this year. The SN Celebration is consistent and delicious as usual. I bought a bottle of the Delirium's Noel, but haven't crack it yet. Some past favorites: '96 Anchor Christmas Ale '97 Old Crustacean Wed Nov 28 13:50:36 -0800 2001 0 Shoeman 1 1551944 Harpoon's Winter Warmer is wonderful...We grabbed a few bottles to take to a BYOB Thai place last nite, and the cinnamon and nutmeg went just great with our grilled fish and garlic watercress...A sip of that, a bite of fish w/fish sauce and Thai bird chilis....WOW! Wed Nov 28 14:09:41 -0800 2001 1551942 0 galleygirl 1 1551949 I am big fan of Samuel Smith's Winter Welcome. A moderately spiced and very flavorful winter ale. Wed Nov 28 14:52:10 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Alan H 2 1551960 Second that one...Another that's great with Asian food...Packs a wallop, tho....Not that that's a BAD thing!!! Wed Nov 28 16:07:33 -0800 2001 1551949 0 galleygirl 2 1552008 I don't think there's any spice, save hops, in Winter Welcome. Thu Nov 29 07:27:01 -0800 2001 1551949 0 Jim Dorsch 1 1551957 It seems every city has a regional microbrewry that is a cut above the rest. Here in the Twin Cities my favorite is Summit Brewing Co. in St. Paul. They make a wonderful Winter Ale. I'm not sure how far they distribute since it is a regional brew but I've seen it as far away as Chicago. Along with Leinenkugel's Bock this is one of the beers I look forward to the most each year. Wed Nov 28 15:36:15 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Sid 1 1551958 I had Sierra Nevada's Celebration Ale over Thanksgiving. It was a little heavy with all the food, but it's really tasty. Next up are the local (Atlanta) winter brews from Dogwood and Sweetwater. Wed Nov 28 15:47:42 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Tater 1 1551969 Pyramid Snow Cap Ale is a new favorite for me. Jim Dorsch recommended this one on the Northwest Board about a month ago, so when I saw it at the store I decided to try it. It's really really good, and I highly recommend it, too. Another good one he turned me onto was Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale. Looking forward to trying some other suggestions, too. Wed Nov 28 18:50:28 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Leslie T. 2 1552009 We're fortunate to have Snow Cap in Northern Virginia this year after seeing none for a couple of years. I tried Wild Goose Snow Goose this year and was pleasantly surprised by its return to form. I last tried it a few years back and thought it had suffered greatly after moving from Cambridge to Frederick as a result of the brewery's sale to Frederick Brewing Co. Snow Goose is a British-style old ale, similar to Snow Cap but not quite as big. Speaking of FBCo, they're the makers of Crooked River, which was mentioned in another post in this thread. Briefly, CR was a Cleveland brewery that was bought by a group that also bought FBCo (which had previously bought Wild Goose of Cambridge and Brimstone of Baltimore, and made its own Blue Ridge line) and Hudpohl-Schoenling of Cincinnati, which makes Little Kings Cream Ale, Christian Moerlein and licensed versions of Whitbread Ale and Mackeson Stout. Thu Nov 29 07:34:26 -0800 2001 1551969 0 Jim Dorsch 3 1552042 Jim, You mentioned trying Snow Goose and it's returning to form. I recently found a six pack of Wild Goose, and after not having it for a few years (I live in N.J.) was delighted to see it back on the shelves. But what a disappointment! This was one of my favorite beers, but the the one from Frederick's is completely different. My guess is that they do not use the same unique Ringwood Yeast. The old Goose is missed, along with a beer called Red Feather from Pa. Ever heard of that one? Thu Nov 29 13:03:29 -0800 2001 1552009 0 John Fox 4 1552102 You're right about the Ringwood yeast, but I do think this year's Snow Goose is a nice beer, even if it's not the same. Many people are disappointed about the WG coming out of Frederick. I'm looking forward to this year's Pyramid Snow Cap, which is in stores now in NoVA. It's similar in style to Snow Goose, but higher gravity. Red Feather was one of my faves. They sold the brewery several years ago, and I think the beer was made under contract for a time, but I don't think it's available anymore. I might be wrong; maybe someone in PA can set me straight. Fri Nov 30 07:10:41 -0800 2001 1552042 0 Jim Dorsch 1 1551973 Anchor, SN Celebration, and Snow Cap are consistently my favorites...but every year there's something new worth trying. One I haven't seen lately is a Grant's winter ale that is meant to be served heated, like mulled wine. Very tasty...anybody seen this around this year? Wed Nov 28 19:32:13 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Tom Hilton 1 1551994 Sam Adams Winter Lager is widely available and is quite nice. I just tried a new one to me: Crooked River Christmas Ale, from Frederick MD. My husband didn't care for the pronounced nutmeg flavor, but I thought it was delicious. Wed Nov 28 23:36:49 -0800 2001 1551942 0 zora 1 1552010 Here in NoVA I've seen Harvey's Christmas Ale from England, and unfortunately there seems to be no De Dolle Stille Nacht from Belgium so far. Brooklyn Brewery's Black Chocolate Stout is in stores, and the Weeping Radish has (contract-brewed in Baltimore) 6pks of their Christmas doppelbock for the first time. North Coast has a Wintertime Ale that's a Belgian-style dubbel. And their Old Stock Ale (essentially a barley wine) is great. Troegs in Harrisburg, PA has a great Oatmeal Stout available in 'cold' months, even though it still hasn't gotten cold here. And who can forget Samichlaus, the 14% lager from Austria? Thu Nov 29 07:40:21 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Jim Dorsch 1 1552038 Out in California, I had the Anderson Valley Winter Solstice last night. Killer suds, with the perfect blend of gingerbread and maltiness. This one has a pretty high gravity, sipping is recomended. This brewery is consistently turning out some of the best ales. Looking forward to Anchor X-mas ale and Deschutes Jubilee ale. Thu Nov 29 12:38:38 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Grog 2 1552058 I also had the Winter Solstice last night, but didn't like it as much as you did. I'd like recommendations for something a little spicier. I hear you about the gravity. . . my pals were more than a little tipsy from one bottle! The weird thing is that my friend delivered it along with some of the regular Boont Amber, and we could barely taste the difference! That was odd. Thu Nov 29 17:15:15 -0800 2001 1552038 0 LisaPizza 3 1552069 I don't know extactly what you mean be "spicier". Spicy means a lot to different folks. To me the winter solstice is very spicy(gingerbread). If your looking for something with a clove component--the Anchor x-mas ale might fit the bill. Grant's, Red Hook, Portland Ale Icycle?, Sierra celebration, Rogue mogule... might be more of what you are looking for. Thu Nov 29 19:04:44 -0800 2001 1552058 0 Grog 4 1552076 Good point about "spicy" meaning many different things. . . BTW, I did enjoy the Winter Solstice ale, just not as a "celebratory" type of drink, if you know what I mean. The pumpkin ale I was just drinking has more of a nutmeg flavor, maybe? And maybe what I really want is something less bitter? I picked up the Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale last weekend and it was definitely more bitter than what I was in the mood for. I think I'm imagining a spiced cider in a beer bottle. :-) For example: I LOVE Hoegaarden. That's a great winter beer, a great summer beer. . . it fits my cravings no matter what the season! I'll try some of your suggestions. The pumpkin is pretty good. I think I picked it up at Trader Joe's. Thu Nov 29 21:33:05 -0800 2001 1552069 0 LisaPizza 4 1552101 Hops are the only spice in Sierra Nevada Celebration Ale. Fri Nov 30 07:05:56 -0800 2001 1552069 0 Jim Dorsch 5 1552147 I'm a novice seasonal beer taster and have just discovered that I'm not very keen on the spicy types of seasonal beers (those that taste like there's something like nutmeg or cloves, etc). However, as I mentioned in a previous post I adore the Pyramid Snow Cap Ale and SR Celebration Ale. Can Jim Dorsch (or anyone else) please recommend some other beers (seasonal or regular) similar to those that I might enjoy as well...if not I guess I will stick to those 2 winners at least until the season is over. Thank you. Another novice question...would this mean then that I like a bitter beer? sorry to sound like such a dope. Fri Nov 30 13:50:27 -0800 2001 1552101 0 Leslie T. 6 1552149 It looks like you might enjoy bitter beers, although both of the beers you mention have good malt to mitigate the bitterness. I love the interplay of malt sweetness and hop bitterness. If you tell us where you live, it will be easier to recommend beers, as many are sold regionally. I'm guessing you're on the west coast, and if that's correct, I won't be able to help you as much as if you lived in the east. Fri Nov 30 14:11:37 -0800 2001 1552147 0 Jim Dorsch 7 1552153 Yes, I'm in the Northwest. Some seasonals that I tried were the Port Orchard Street Jingle (too spicy for me), Deschutes Jubelale (good, but not as good as Snow Cap or Celebration), Full Sail Wassail (ditto). Fortunately, it doesn't cost a lot to experiment. Thanks for all the help. Fri Nov 30 14:58:53 -0800 2001 1552149 0 Leslie T. 8 1552193 You are in the middle of SUDS HEAVEN. I am so envious. I have been to Seattle a few times. There is a bar on every corner. Red Hook is their version of Budwiser. Are you in Seattle? I remeber a place called Elysium-couldn't tell you where it was--but they brew great beer. I stayed in the area right near the Locks. We regularly drank at a place called the "Lock Spot". Sorry but my memory is a bit foggy to remember all the great local brews. Back on the subject...looks like you were right about liking the bitter quality. I would look for anything that has an ESB (extra special bitter) or IPA (India pale ale)0n the label. Both styles use hops to create that bitter taste you like. Start with single bottles so you can get an idea of what you like. I use to hold beer tasting parties (a lot cheaper than wine tastings). Gather up some friends and a bunch of beers and small paper bags to conceal the IDs. Blind taste each one. You may be pleasantly surprised at what you discover. Cheers! Sat Dec 01 11:10:11 -0800 2001 1552153 0 Grog--LA, CA 9 1552195 I think you were at Elysian Brewing Co. Sat Dec 01 11:16:24 -0800 2001 1552193 0 Jim Dorsch 10 1552197 That's it--oooh the strong ale!!! Sat Dec 01 11:18:44 -0800 2001 1552195 0 Grog--LA, CA 6 1552198 You're not a "dope"! This is what we do here: fill in each other's knowledge gaps! Jim's right (of course) in saying that while those beers are quite bitter, they have malt to balance. But a few things. Nearly all beer is, to some degree, a painting in three colors: malt, hops, and yeast. The overwhelming majority of American beers don't use characterful yeast (and hence, to a Belgophille like me, lack a certain depth), so you've got more of a bipolar flavor. There are different sorts of hops (they're a relative of cannabis, FWIW) with different sorts of effects, but any citrusy (especially grapefruity), floral, cedary, resinous aromas or bitter tastes come from one or more varieties of hops. Malt used in brewing is startlingly similar to malted milk. It's sweet and earthy. They roast the stuff, and the degree of roasting produces the beer's color (stouts are nearly burnt, pilseners are very lightly roasted) and helps determine the malt character, which can range from raw-grainy to tootsie rollish to caramely to ashy, with lots of steps in between. Since the only diff between lighter-colored beer and darker-colored beer is the degree of roast, you'll understand why the myth that darker beer is stronger is just a myth. It's a roasting thing, period. Light beers (though not "lite" beers) can be strong, dark beers can be weak. And ales or lagers can be as well (diff between the two--and they are the two main sub-categories of beer--is the temperature at which they're fermented and the category of yeast used). One note to stave off over-simplification: more than one variety of hop and more than one roast of malt can be--and often is--used in the creation of a beer. Only one yeast, though. There are indeed beers skewed toward one or the other side of the spectrum. Those who prefer hoppy beers are known as "hop-heads". Those who like it malty....well, go to England (many British beers have copious hop character as well, but it's a softer, more aromatic hoppiness than the gnarly bitterness you find in American hoppy beers....the gnarliest of which can be found in the Pacific Northwest, where many much-loved beers scrape your tongue as they go down). The British hopping is so gentle and subtle that it often doesn't survive the import trip, unfortunately. If you hear about casks specially imported from there, drop everything and try them. so analyze what it is you like about certain beers. If you're turned on more by either maltiness or hoppiness, then you know what to quest for. If you like both......then it's balance you seek. Which limits your choices (because balance takes serious skill and touch to produce). ciao Sat Dec 01 11:57:10 -0800 2001 1552147 0 Jim Leff 7 1552203 When I used to brew my own beer, I loved fuggles hops, so fragrant. I would add a good dose to a prehopped malt (in other words, barely hopped) with some extra grains. Clusters is hideous. It's only bitter, no fragrance, but lots of brewers use it because it's really cheap (grows easily and prolifically) and many drinkers don't care. Sat Dec 01 16:05:45 -0800 2001 1552198 0 ironmom 8 1552204 But since hops are not an essential ingredient, cheapness is only significant if you NEED to achieve a given hoppy effect in the first place. And that effect, in this case, is bitterness.....raw, gnarly bitterness. Which is something many drinkers (esp. in Pacific NW) want, need, crave. As with hot sauce addicts, they require more and more as their tolerance builds. Sat Dec 01 16:14:14 -0800 2001 1552203 0 Jim Leff 7 1552208 Thank you Jim L., Jim D. and Grog-LA for the great info and taking the time to explain it to me. Much appreciated. Sat Dec 01 18:02:34 -0800 2001 1552198 0 Leslie T. 7 1552219 Good explanation, Jim. A couple of additional points: Although the roast of the malt doesn't affect the alcohol content, it does affect the body of the beer. The darker the roast, the more of the starch left behind, and so darker beers are "heavier." And as far as hops go, some are added early in the brewing process to provide (mostly) bitterness and astringency, but some are added very late to provide (mostly) "nose" -- that unmistakable hops aroma. Sun Dec 02 00:50:50 -0800 2001 1552198 0 Janet A. Zimmerman 5 1552165 I guess that explains why it wasn't spicy enough for me. :-) I wondered why it didn't say anything on the bottle about "spices." It was recommended to me by a wine/beer guy I trust, but now I realize he was steering me AWAY from spicy ales. Fri Nov 30 19:33:33 -0800 2001 1552101 0 LisaPizza 3 1552075 Winter Solstice sounds great!!! I gottah get some..But if you want spicier, try that Harpoon Winter Warmer ..I'll have to go out and get BOTH tomorrow! Thu Nov 29 21:31:30 -0800 2001 1552058 0 galleygirl 1 1552096 Old Crustacean! What a great name. I'd buy it just to have the bottle. Is it still available? Fri Nov 30 06:47:28 -0800 2001 1551942 0 christina z 2 1552100 You might find Old Crusty in nip bottles, but it's not easy to find here in the East, although other Rogue beers are readily available. If you can't find it, try another great one, Sierra Nevada Bigfoot. It should appear around Feb. Fri Nov 30 07:02:30 -0800 2001 1552096 0 Jim Dorsch 3 1552112 When it comes to BW--gotta go with the one and only Anchor Foghorn. Fri Nov 30 10:29:30 -0800 2001 1552100 0 Grog--LA, CA 4 1552143 Old Foghorn is a classic, but I prefer a hoppier barley wine myself. For that matter, I prefer a hoppier variety of just about any beer! Fri Nov 30 12:58:03 -0800 2001 1552112 0 Jim Dorsch 5 1552150 You must prefer the Liberty Ale--and some of the IPA/ESBs out there. Have you tried the Anderson IPA Hop Ottin' and/or the ESB-Belk's Bitter? Both are regular quafers. I'm also a fan of the Deschutes Ales, North Coast BC's Rasputan and the Mendocino BC's Eye of the Hawk. Fri Nov 30 14:24:04 -0800 2001 1552143 0 Grog--LA, CA 6 1552152 Anchor Liberty was a real stunner when it appeared about 25 years ago, but today there are so many really hoppy beers. Hop Ottin is a great one. One I like a lot is Stone Arrogant Bastard from the San Diego area. Here in the east we get the wonderful Tuppers' Hop Pocket Ale, a bottle-conditioned, dry-hopped ale. And Victory HopDevil IPA is good, too. Up in DE, Dogfish Head produces an astoundingly hoppy 90 Minute IPA, with 9% alcohol by volume. Many British folks say American beer is out of balance. They're right, and I don't care. Fri Nov 30 14:53:48 -0800 2001 1552150 0 Jim Dorsch 7 1552162 Jim, nice to meet a fellow hophead. The hoppier the better for me. In terms of BW, I'll take Old Crusty over Foghorn anyday. Fri Nov 30 18:22:41 -0800 2001 1552152 0 Shoeman 7 1552173 My personal preference is for a rich, malty ale that doesn't require the drinking of a quart of water to wash the taste out of my mouth afterwards. Americans want everything over-the-top. More artificial flavoring in the coffee, more toppings on the pizza, and more hops in the beer. As long as I'm wishing for things I can't have, I'd like a barley wine that comes in a single serving bottle (like Sam Adams, only not like a bad sherry) so you don't have to decant a 20 ounce bottle to get it off the lees if you only want to drink 10 ounces. Fri Nov 30 22:10:14 -0800 2001 1552152 0 ironmom 8 1552174 Old Foghorn used to come in a nip bottle, but I haven't seen that package in a long time. You might find Old Crustacean in a nip, but it ain't cheap. Fri Nov 30 22:19:32 -0800 2001 1552173 0 Jim Dorsch 9 1552192 Old Foghorn is still available in the "nip" bottle. They sell 6-packs (or is it 4-packs?) of them at our local market here in San Francisco. Sat Dec 01 10:50:27 -0800 2001 1552174 0 Nancy Berry 10 1552194 I think it's a 6pk. The wholesaler must have just stopped carrying them in my area. Sat Dec 01 11:15:14 -0800 2001 1552192 0 Jim Dorsch 7 1552196 One of my favorites I fogot to mention is HAIR OF THE DOG-Portland, Or. You are likely familiar with it. I think the "Ruth" beer is one hell of an "over-the-top-American" beer. If you've not tried their stuff it's mostly Belgium style beers but the Ruth is-I think an ESB. Sat Dec 01 11:16:40 -0800 2001 1552152 0 Grog--LA, CA 8 1552223 HOTD has been unavailable in my area for several years, but everything I've had is great! ESB would be a departure for them, since it's a regular-strength beer. Sun Dec 02 07:12:34 -0800 2001 1552196 0 Jim Dorsch 1 1552106 Last night I made J. Oliver's green chili curry with chicken which paired perfectly with a bottle of Voove a belgium beer. Tons of corriander and mint, simply awesome. Jim D. are you familar with this one. I would be interested in more infor. Fri Nov 30 10:10:57 -0800 2001 1551942 0 Shoeman 2 1552117 I haven't had it, but I think you refer to Vuuve. There is some information at link below. Link: http://www.bunitedint.com/vuuve.html Fri Nov 30 10:48:47 -0800 2001 1552106 0 Jim Dorsch 3 1552137 Your exactly right. Thanks for the infor. Fri Nov 30 12:30:05 -0800 2001 1552117 0 Shoeman 1 1552708 I don't know about you guys but my favourite seasonal beer comes in the summer: Leinenkugel's Berry Weiss, which I cannot get here in California (and don't get back to America's Dairyland often enough to import). Thu Dec 27 16:57:07 -0800 2001 1551942 0 PRSMDave