286903 Wed Jan 31 21:18:52 -0800 2001 40 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1540361 The title really says it all. For a school project, my wife is compiling a syllabus of books that approach sweets and desserts from a sociological/anthropological perspective. We've found a few promising titles, specifically those that focus on food as a whole, but I just wondered if the brilliant C-hound community had any more thoughts? Wed Jan 31 21:18:52 -0800 2001 0 Jeff Shore 1 1540364 Sophie Coe wrote a book about chocolate, "The History of Chocolate" or something... Wed Jan 31 22:27:19 -0800 2001 1540361 0 dan 1 1540365 might want to look into chocolate makers' reports on where they test their products. Mars in the US probably has a plan on where to test "sweets". This might be really interesting to children-food, geography, sociology. In the UK, confectioners (e.g., Mars and Fry's) used to send their new products to Scotland, as the kids there had, and probably still have, the highest consumption of sweet things in UK. You might want to look up Wall Street Journal (on web if available) as they sent a poor reporter to Glasgow in last few years to see if he could find fresh fruits and veg. All he could find: sweets and cigarettes. Wed Jan 31 23:00:12 -0800 2001 1540361 0 yvonne johnson 1 1540367 What about going to primary sources? If you look at early (pre-1918)copies of Fannie Farmer and other very early home economics texts, it is very interesting what people considered normal everyday and party fare. I've gotten some of my best laughs ever looking through a Ladies Auxiliary Cookbook from the '60's. Plastic ring binding and hokey advertising aside -- it says a lot about life for these women at the time ("A real man-pleaser"). What kills me is that you would be unable to complete most of the recipes in the book I have without: mini-marshmallows, canned pineapple rings, jello, mini-sausages, canned water chestnuts and the like. (No, I'm not just talking about the dessert section.) So now that I've libeled the cooking of my mother-in-law and the good ladies of Hood River, Oregon, I will meekly add that from a sociological and anthropological view you have a marvelous resource in your average local library in the cookbook section. Cheers! Wed Jan 31 23:01:48 -0800 2001 1540361 0 Anne Emry 1 1540373 I'm a Spam Fan - America's Best-Loved Foods by Carolyn Wyman is an interesting look at many of America's favorite foods. Fun reading and good memories. Thu Feb 01 01:39:10 -0800 2001 1540361 0 gordon wing 2 1540386 Gordon, I was intrigued by your comment, "I'm a Spam fan." The food product seems to be always greeted with ridicule and disdain--do you have some fav recipes? Or do you appreciate the all-American aesthetic? (I actually bought a can for its cool look to use as a coin bank and have a great Spam t-shirt. But don't think I've ever tasted the stuff.)Please share! Thu Feb 01 10:29:00 -0800 2001 1540373 0 berkleybabe 3 1540409 In Hawaii you can get "Spam Musubi", which is seasoned Spam on top of sushi rice, held in place with a strip of nori/seaweed. I'm curious; it's supposed to be quite popular locally. See the link below for pictures. Best, Deb H. Link: http://kalama.doe.hawaii.edu/hern95/pt027/LearnFromLunch/StephanieKoga/LocalLunches/musubi.html Thu Feb 01 14:46:47 -0800 2001 1540386 0 Deb H. 4 1540413 Among my Japanese-American friends, spam maki are very popular with the kids at family gatherings. Thu Feb 01 15:52:47 -0800 2001 1540409 0 Melanie Wong 5 1540416 How are the Spam maki different from the musubi? I wonder if you could use Taylor ham.....mmmmm? Thu Feb 01 16:33:10 -0800 2001 1540413 0 berkleybabe 6 1540421 I would think that while Musubi is basically nigiri-style sushi tied together with nori (musubu is Japanese for 'to tie' or 'to link'), the Maki is Spam and rice rolled inside a long sheet of nori (maku is Japanese for 'to wrap'). The rolls you get at sushi bars are Maki. Melanie? Deb H. Thu Feb 01 16:53:27 -0800 2001 1540416 0 Deb H. 7 1540447 Yes, exactly. I think the extra nori on the maki rolls provides better balance for the whole taste presentation. :-) Late night news item yesterday was an announcement of the winner of this year's Spam recipe contest. Didn't catch the details. Fri Feb 02 20:48:24 -0800 2001 1540421 0 Melanie Wong 4 1540415 Where else but on these hallowed boards could you find a four color picture(!) of Spam sushi. The delights of chowhounding are endless...thanks for the cool link. I'll have to try this stuff--I actually have a tin in the basement pantry. I thought to use for camping kind of like a North woods egg McMuffin--never went camping, though. Thu Feb 01 16:30:39 -0800 2001 1540409 0 berkleybabe 4 1540420 Actually according to Hormel's sales statistics, Hawaii is the largest consumer of Spam in the entire world. Theres an entire Hawaiian cookbook dedicated to Spam: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0935848495/o/qid=981063740/sr=8-1/ref=aps_sr_b_1_1/102-5542311-3809766 Link: http://www.spam.com Thu Feb 01 16:47:00 -0800 2001 1540409 0 Jason Perlow 4 1540424 Very interesting. My old friend and fellow-Spam breakfast lover that I mentioned in my previous post is Korean and according to her and several other friends of mine, it is or was quite popular in Korea. My Czech grandparents also really liked it (fried Spam and onions). My theory on that is that it resembles forcemeat, which is rears its ugly head to this day on menus in the Czech Republic. Thu Feb 01 18:20:10 -0800 2001 1540409 0 Lauren 5 1540425 Does anyone know if the Koreans' fondness for Spam has anything to do with the Korean War? That would make sense. pat Thu Feb 01 18:46:49 -0800 2001 1540424 0 pat hammond 6 1540430 Right, Pat. SPAM is popular in Korea (and Hawaii) as a byproduct :-) of the military presence. Thu Feb 01 22:56:34 -0800 2001 1540425 0 Jennifer 6 1540444 Recently, breakfast at a B&B in havana (a private home operated as a one-room hotel) the prop served us eggs and spam. I told her "Oh, we told you, my girlfriend does not eat meat". She actually said in all seriousness "This is not meat, it's Spam." Fri Feb 02 16:08:16 -0800 2001 1540425 0 keith k 6 1540551 Yup. In fact, my mom (who happens to be Korean) would put Spam in her sushi rolls. While I used to love it as a kid, the thought of it makes me nauseous. But Spam in fried rice is a great! Sat Feb 10 12:49:57 -0800 2001 1540425 0 Jen 5 1540438 a friend of mine just took a business trip to Guam, in the Pacific. He thought most of the food weird or bad versions of American food, so finally broke down and ordered a Pizza Hut 'meat lover's' Pizza. Many of the restaurants in the area featured spam dishes, but to his surprise, his pizza came covered with SPAM! i've read about a hypothesis that Pacific Islanders love Spam soooo much because it tastes vaguely of human flesh. The connection: polynesians and pacific islanders mostly share a culture which included cannibalism (either ritually or for dietary purposes. I doubt it's true, but it sounds neat, don't it? Fri Feb 02 12:34:17 -0800 2001 1540424 0 Andy Huse 5 1540439 a friend of mine just took a business trip to Guam, in the Pacific. He thought most of the food weird or bad versions of American food, so finally broke down and ordered a Pizza Hut 'meat lover's' Pizza. Many of the restaurants in the area featured spam dishes, but to his surprise, his pizza came covered with SPAM! i've read about a hypothesis that Pacific Islanders love Spam soooo much because it tastes vaguely of human flesh. The connection: polynesians and pacific islanders mostly share a culture which included cannibalism (either ritually or for dietary purposes. I doubt it's true, but it sounds neat, don't it? Fri Feb 02 12:34:18 -0800 2001 1540424 0 Andy Huse 6 1540442 I lived in Montreal in the 1970's for a while and there were pizzerias that sold a "tout garni" pizza that came with a suspicious layer of meat underneath the cheese. In retrospect I'm pretty sure it was thinly sliced spam. Fri Feb 02 14:20:34 -0800 2001 1540439 0 rjka 6 1541079 I do not think that is true. Ancient Chamorros(Guamanians) do not have a history of cannibalism or any type of cannibalistic rituals. I believe that Guamanians love Spam because of their involvement with World War II. During World War II, Guam having the military bases, underwent attack and were invaded by the Japanese. During this time, food rationing was very crucial, and I am sure that having canned food around was important. Another reason may be the fact that Guam has so many typhoons, often times leaving the island with no electricity. . .which means no refrigeration, and resorting to canned foods is once again necessary. Eventually this all lead to the love of the wonderful luncheun meat: SPAM. Sat Dec 18 07:32:57 -0800 2004 1540439 0 hazel 7 1541080 Thank God you posted your theory, otherwise I'd have thought of Spam as human flesh for the rest of my life!!! Sat Dec 18 15:54:28 -0800 2004 1541079 0 coll 8 1541082 What makes you think that Spam tastes like human flesh? Far as I've heard, humans taste like salty (heavily-brined) pork. Depending on the cut you eat, we're equivalent to either sinewy pork shoulder butt or the more tender loin. Spam is smokier. Sun Feb 20 23:14:29 -0800 2005 1541080 0 Omnivora 9 1541083 "What makes you think that Spam tastes like human flesh?" If Chowhound allowed the use of tag lines, that would be the one I would choose. Your post belongs in the CH hall of fame. PS - I am much relieved that you included the "Far as I've heard" disclaimer before you described the taste of humans in detail. Tue Feb 22 12:41:05 -0800 2005 1541082 0 Bob Martinez 7 1541081 i think thats mainly it. there are no records guamanians were cannibals (and this side of the region as well). certainly right after world war II, no one on guam is going to know what cannibalism tastes like because it had been an american territory since 1898 and spanish territory since magellan's discovers, and neither country would have tolerated it. Fri Jan 14 19:55:57 -0800 2005 1541079 0 jerome 3 1540431 I'm not really a big spam fan. I haven't had any in years. It used to be camping food. I have 4 cans of it on my desk - acting as pillars on my makeshift computer center.... allowing me to slide my keyboard and mouse under my Mac. Did you know that there are 4 flavors of Spam? ....Spam Lite, Spam with 25% less sodium, Spam smoke flavored and Regular. When I first moved to the East Bay many years ago I remember that the Royal Cafe used to have a great t-shirt with a weird looking character and a spam omelette? I never did order one but I love the idea! Fri Feb 02 02:29:07 -0800 2001 1540386 0 gordon wing 4 1540435 If you still have to have that tshirt check out spam.com--lots of merchandise. Then when I see you walking down the streets in Berkeley I'll know it's you! Fri Feb 02 11:02:52 -0800 2001 1540431 0 Jennifer 5 1540436 I checked out the site last night -awesome! Loved the tie--I'm tempted. But you won't see me in Berkeley, but in Berkley (MI)--the lesser. May even open my one can I've ever bought that's never been camping this weekend for a first taste. Fri Feb 02 11:18:27 -0800 2001 1540435 0 berkleybabe 5 1540452 Thanks, I'll check out that web site and see if I can resist the temptation to adorn myself with a spam t-shirt! Sat Feb 03 02:56:07 -0800 2001 1540435 0 gordon wing 6 1540458 Three of us in our relatively small area wear ours regularly. For more formal occasions, there's always the Spam tie on the site--actually pretty cool. Not, of course, that we'd ever eat the stuff...we just like the packaging and commercial application. :) Sat Feb 03 19:44:17 -0800 2001 1540452 0 berkleybabe 3 1540432 Berkeley babe, Did you realize that the name of the book was .... I'm a Spam Fan. I like the idea of Spam but I'm not sure I'm really a committed fan. Fri Feb 02 02:37:52 -0800 2001 1540386 0 gordon wing 1 1540379 Not solely devoted to sweets, but parts of Margaret Visser's books are germane. Aand I highly recommend Elizabeth David's Harvest of the Frozen Months (think that's the title), which is a beautifully written history of ice cream. Thu Feb 01 08:38:35 -0800 2001 1540361 0 Martha Gehan 1 1540382 From my own shelves, I see that Waverly Root's "Eating in America, a History" has a chapter entitled "The Great American Sweet Tooth." James Trager's "Foodbook" covers the subject only cursorily, but has an extensive bibliography. I took a quick look through MFK Fisher's books, but didn't spot anything in passing. An excellent source of material is found in novels (from your note, I assume film sources are not suitable.). Charles Dickens' "Martin Chuzzlewit" comes to mind. I remember a hilarious scene in an American boarding house, and I venture desserts and sweets play a role in it. I am sorry, but my copy is not readily available, so I cannot check the details. Perhaps Chowhounds can suggest other non-scholarly sources. Thu Feb 01 09:18:49 -0800 2001 1540361 0 Pat Goldberg 1 1540384 Jeff, There's a pretty famous passage in Swann's Way, by Proust, where the narrator tastes a tea-soaked petit madeleine and is immediately transported in memory to a time in the distant past. Tastes evoking memories. Don't know if this would be helpful but it's a beautiful passage, nonetheless. pat Thu Feb 01 09:58:39 -0800 2001 1540361 0 Pat Hammond 2 1540385 Yes, Pat--and while we're discussing literature, there's a GREAT, quite short scene in Anna Karenina set in a restaurant where two of the characters are dining that speaks volumes about the Russian society of the time. Thu Feb 01 10:08:10 -0800 2001 1540384 0 Martha Gehan 2 1540407 I remember that passage as being in Proust's _A Remembrance of Things Past_. Or is Swann's Way a part of _Remembrance_? Working on my own memory, Deb H. Thu Feb 01 14:28:40 -0800 2001 1540384 0 Deb H. 3 1540411 Been looking for my copy. But yes, Swann's Way is a part of Remembrance...Pat Thu Feb 01 15:10:18 -0800 2001 1540407 0 pat hammond 1 1540394 There's a book out called "Sweetness and Power: The Place of Sugar in Modern History" by Sidney Mintz. I've read an excerpt from it; interesting but dense. There's also a chapter devoted to chocolate in a book called "Tastes of Paradise: A Social History of Spices, Stimulants and Intoxicants" by Wolfgang Schivelbusch. That book is a bit dry in parts, but it's very informative. Thu Feb 01 12:33:39 -0800 2001 1540361 0 Janet A. Zimmerman 2 1540460 Far be it from me to recommend one of my own books, but here I go again. In "American Appetite: The Coming of Age of a Cuisine," which is largely a book of cultural and social history and cultural criticism, I look at America's proclivities toward sweets in a number of places, including our tendency to over-use sugar in savory dishes, as well as a section about the use of words like "sinful" to describe desserts (I talk a lot about how puritanism informs what we eat). I also highly recommend two books I used as sources: John and Karen Hess's "A Taste of America" (one of my favorite books), and Sidney Mintz's "Sweetness and Power," (mentioned in the preceding post). Both are excellent, as is Waverly Root's. Sun Feb 04 15:31:30 -0800 2001 1540394 0 Leslie Brenner 1 1540459 you might check out the new cambridge companion to food, which i received for christmas but couldn't lug back to new york with me and consequently can't check for you to see if there's anything in there. but they really had some terrific anthropological, historical, biological essays in there. it's a wonderful reference. they'd have a bibliography, too, if there were an entry on your topic. Sun Feb 04 12:39:30 -0800 2001 1540361 0 emily