263843 Fri Jan 16 10:39:08 -0800 2004 7 26 International 0 1393524 Undeservingly and surprisingly, Fat Duck gets three Michelin stars in the 04 Red Guide for the UK. I've had good meals there, but they were not at the three star (incl. Gordon Ramsay RHR) level One new two-star -- Hibiscus at Ludlow. 14 new one-stars. Fri Jan 16 10:39:08 -0800 2004 0 cabrales 1 1393526 Since when is Michelin infallible? Fri Jan 16 11:46:53 -0800 2004 1393524 0 Nina W. 1 1393527 This is terrible news. Pierre Koffman should not have been demoted to two stars when he moved La Tante Claire (now closed) to The Berkeley. The cuisine of LTC at The Berkely remained as good as ever. Fri Jan 16 12:21:47 -0800 2004 1393524 0 cabrales 2 1393528 Obviously, the Michelin reviewers have a different opinion. Tant pis. Fri Jan 16 12:59:03 -0800 2004 1393527 0 Nina W. 2 1393539 I ate at Le Tainte Claire at the Berkeley about three years ago. Respectfully, but I disagree with you on this one. Certainly a wonderful presentation, perhaps with flair, but the food was overall very good but no better. On the same trip meals at Zaika and Zafferano (both with single stars) were much more satisfying. By the way I gave up on getting in to L'Astrance and with my business over left Paris today to return home. Several friends had dinner at Le Grand Vefour and pronounced the three star "superb." They also told me that the bill for the six of them was 2,100 Euros. Cabby, that's US $2,700 for dinner for six people!!! Nine hundred dollars a couple!!!! They were celebrating a several million dollar sale but said they wouldn't do it again. They were shell shocked at the prix fixe and the cost of wine yet were in a position where they couldn't back out since they were entertaining. This is exactly what concerned me when I said that I backed out of entertaining because of concern about the price. Many meals like this are frequented by people like myself, a salesman or a lobbyist. Yet, I think most customers would think that if I can afford a meal like this (which I honestly cannot) then I am obviously charging far too much for what I sell. I realize that many can afford this regardless of the rate of exchange. But $450 per person is a great deal of money for a meal. (or for a 36" television!) For me it is no wonder that so many top end restaurants fail, especially the very few that are on this level. Grand Vefour was almost empty from what I undestand. Fri Jan 16 22:37:36 -0800 2004 1393527 0 Joe H. 3 1393549 I'd have to say that $450/person is not that unusual at a three-star, for dinner, when nice wines are being ordered. I don't know how to address the point about entertaining, when one wants to impress a potential client or a client and has a budget in mind. I wonder how much the GV prix fixe is at night -- is it a tasting menu? I've only visited during lunch, because I'm not particularly impressed with the cuisine. Turning away from GV and addressing a more general question, if one can't be sure the client would pick the prix fixe menu, even choosing a three-star with a reasonably priced prix fixe lunch (say, Lucas-Carton or Grand Vefour or Le Cinq) has dangerous aspects. Similarly for dinner. If one were to invite a client to Gagnaire and expect to spend the price of the "normal" tasting menu during dinner, what happens if Gagnaire also has a truffle menu (as his website currently indicates) and the client orders that, or goes a la carte (ordering cheese and every other course)? I don't mean to sound unsympathetic, but your friends should have anticipated the $450 type of price range as a possibility, and couldn't have thought they could have gotten away with less than $275-350 US/person even with less expensive wine, at prevailing exchange rate levels. I also believe the price of a color TV is not necessarily relevant, in my assessment. Of course the price of meals could be put to many alternative uses. How an individual chooses to allocate her expenditures depends on what pleases her. Hopefully, somebody spending $450 at GV wouldn't be in need of a new TV and sacrificing it for the meal. But if a person were choosing a meal over a color TV, that's her perogative and hopefully she would be making that choice knowingly. I also believe the reference to a color TV is slightly alluding to the debate that certain purchases have a long useful life (e.g., TVs) and/or might have the potential to appreciate in value (e.g., a painting), while meals arguably are experienced for a more limited period of time. I don't happen to see things that way, but that's a discussion for another day. As for your indication that you preferred Zaika and Zafferano to La Tante Claire, that's your assessment and we clearly disagree. Zafferano under locatelli was the best Italian restaurant in London, but its cuisine was only fairly good. I would say the same of locanda locatelli. I've never been to, and do not plan to go to, Zaika. LTC was not at the level of Gordon Ramsay RHR and at one point I even thought perhaps LTC's demotion was arguably not a clear mistake if RHR were the standard. However, upon reflection, I now believe that LTC had many good qualities. On Blumenthal, when he was conducting a Q&A on another boared, I asked him whether I could stage in his kitchens. Had had readily agreed. His third star motivates me a bit more to follow up on that :) Sat Jan 17 08:07:20 -0800 2004 1393539 0 cabrales 1 1393531 Coming from possibly the world's most experienced diner at this level (certainly far more experienced than any U.K. Michelin inspector), this is a fasciniating insight. Thankyou Fri Jan 16 17:09:05 -0800 2004 1393524 0 Louis 2 1393533 Err, I'm definitely less experienced than any Michelin inspector. But thanks for the vote of confidence (although is definitely undeserved). To clarify, I believe Fat Duck has a fairly good cuisine. I just don't believe its cuisine is anywhere close to that of a three-star. Meal from 2002: I had lunch at the much-discussed Blumenthal's Fat Duck in Bray today. This was my first visit, and I had a very good meal.... The lunch special menu is a very good value-for-money. I could have had a wonderful meal for under Pounds 40 with wine by the glass, had I cared to limit costs. Lunch Menu, Three Courses at Pounds 27.50 (Items not chosen included in square brackets) -- Snail Porridge, Jabugo Ham, [Veloute of pumpkin, fricasse of ceps and pigs' cheeks, or Parfait of foie gras, fig compote and Banyuls] -- Braised Lamb Shank, [Petit sale of duck, green coffee sauce, pommes puree, or Poached skate wing, cockles, braised celeriac, and tonka bean veloute] -- Salted Butter Caramel, roasted pistachios and peanuts, chocolate sorbet and cumin caramel [or Nougat Glace, praline rose, fromage blanc ice cream] Glass of Louis Roederer champagne (approx. 13-14) Glass of Aligote Goisot, 2000 (5.50) Glass of Chateau Jouvent Graves 1996 (9.00) Coffee and petits fours (separate charge, 3.95) The first amuse was average -- an emulsion of green tea and lime sour, served in a slender V-shaped glass. This was light and airy (perhaps due to Adria influences? note I have never eaten at El Bulli). A dining room staff member indicated that vodka had likely been utilized in the dish, but this was not apparent. The tea flavors were too suppressed, resulting in a certain blandness and an emphasis on the citrus elements of the flavoring. The lime tasted much more like green apple to me, with nice notes of sweetness combined with sourness. Overall, however, this dish was still slightly bland and tended on the insubstantial side. Then, a much better second amuse of a little serving of Pommery mustard ice cream, to which was added (from a cute ceramic jug) a gaspacho of red cabbage. Amusingly and wonderfully, this liquid was a beautiful medium purple in color. It tasted refreshing and yet also (appropriately) salty and with a subtle "kick". I do not recollect having seen a purple this intense in a dish, except when violets or lavendar saucing was used (e.g., Club Gascon). The appetizer of snail porridge was appealing. I generally do not like oats, but here softened small oats were integrated with diced bits of snail, garlic and parsley. A parsley-based oil bound this satisfying dish together. The Jabugo was appropriately limited to thin slivers atop the porridge mixture. The reference to porridge is a misnomer, if it connoted Chinese-style congee consistency. This dish was much more a risotto-type preparation. On top of this mixture were placed thin, translucent strands of fennel -- this was unnecessary in my assessment. The Aligote white Burgundy taken with this dish is a relatively classic pairing with snails. For me, the snail porridge was the best dish of the meal. The lamb shank tasted good as well. I received a very generous portion, with a large angular expanse of bone protruding from it. The textures were nicely varied, with the caramelised and darkened overtones of the outer portions of the shank giving way to tender, well-prepared flesh inside. The only very minor area of improvement was that the sauce, which was nicely made, was a very little bit sweeter than I personally would have preferred. Softened slices of carrots were a good accompaniment. A dish I enjoyed, and paired with an appropriate wine by the glass recommended by the sommelier. A trio of pre-desserts arrived. A thin circular-shaped crisp, which the maitre d' described as a "lollipop", with red chilli flavor; a beetroot gelee (quite dense, but not in a negative way) and a tart with basil and a bit of dried fennel on top. Quite different, although it highlighted the desire to be different as well (I guess there's nothing wrong with trying to appear innovative). The dessert was a rich, elastic piece of dark-tasting caramel. As discussed in the "Pierre Herme" thread under France, there is a trend to combine saltiness with sweet sensations in dessert, and this dessert was consistent with that trend. The salted butter did add interesting elements to the caramel, and, while not a big fan of chocolate, I liked the melting chocolate sorbet as it hit the caramel. There were too many hard pistachio bits embeded in the caramel piece for my liking, but that is a pet peeve. The cumin ingredient in this dessert, described on the menu, was not noticeable. The meal ended with a chocolate containing tobacco (a la Adria), with a thin crisp (as thin as a veil) with bacon flavors (taken separately). A very good meal, with no obvious flaws. I am beginning to consider accepting the position that it might not matter whether Blumenthal derives "inspiration" from other chefs, so long as his food tastes the way it does. Fat Duck deserves its two Michelin stars. Modern and well-prepared food. Perhaps Blumenthal tries hard to make his dishes seem innovative, but the flavor combinations on the plate generally worked. I also found the menu interesting enough to ask whether there was a table available for tonight or tomorrow's lunch, perhaps due to cancellations. (Unfortunately not yet) The restaurant appears to be less busy during Saturday lunch than during Saturday night or Sunday lunch. It is closed Sunday dinner and Monday all day. Access, Decor and Service Bray can be accessed from Paddington station, from which I took a 30-40 minute trainride to Maidenhead (Pounds 7.50 return fare). Then, a quick (less than 10 minute) cab ride (approx. Pounds 5-6 each way) brought me to the little bend in the road that I had passed at various times on my way to Waterside Inn in the same town/village. There was the Fat Duck! The exterior of the restaurant is quite unassuming. However, the interior is modern, with hues of yellow, turquoise, and some limited amount of purple/light green in the artwork. Wooden beams. A fireplace area with a modern-looking sculpture placed inside. Chairs of a color between mustard yellow and a light olive. Modern artwork, and a large glass wall area near the entryway with blue hues. The maitre d' was wonderfully detailed in explaining each dish. The dining room team member who, together with the maitre d', primarily assisted me spoke fluent French (Andy -- I don't know why I like speaking French at restaurants in London, but I do). The sommeliers recommended fitting selections by the glass, and were knowledgeable and friendly (and spoke French). It was nice that the service was effective, but not stuffy. I liked the "French" aspects of this restaurant: (1) the availability of Chateldon sparkling water (less common in London and not available at, for example, Petrus), (2) the provision of Langiole knives for the lamb, and (3) butter from France, brought to a table in a large circular slab and described as having been aged appropriately (this butter did not taste impressive, but the effort was there). A fairly strong, although in some cases not inexpensive, wine list (including Delamotte champagne, an item I like alot even though it probably does not have appeal to most). Fri Jan 16 17:35:29 -0800 2004 1393531 0 cabrales