23143 Wed Feb 26 04:20:40 -0800 2003 10 1 San Francisco Bay Area 0 87351 Interesting article about Fred Franzia and his Bronco Wine Co., repsonsible for the Charles Shaw phenomenom recently. I seem to remember some interest about it recently on this board, and Melanie had posted some links. From Wed.'s LA Times. Link: http://www.latimes.com/features/food/la-fo-franzia26feb26,1,115052.story?coll=la%2Dhome2%2Dutilities Wed Feb 26 04:20:40 -0800 2003 0 ericf 1 87352 I tried the Charles Shaw wines (I believe there are 4 varietals), and for $2 a bottle, they're not bad. However, they're not very interesting either. I'd rather spend a few dollars more (okay, maybe more than a few dollars) to find something more intriguing. It's all up to the individual though. 2 Buck Chuck sure will save lots of party planners plenty of money. Hard to believe they're making $2 a case on it. That means after you account for the glass bottle, the cork, the label, the case box, shipping, taxes, labor, storage, etc., the wine in the bottle costs them well under 20 cents. Amazing! Wed Feb 26 05:00:14 -0800 2003 87351 0 ed k 2 87354 Ed, I spoke to one fine wine retailer who's been following this phenomenon. He said that his contacts at TJ say that it has been a great entry level wine for folks who don't normally drink wine or think of it as a special occasion beverage. One of the barriers for many Americans to ordering wine at a restaurant or even buying at retail is the notion that they need more "education" to make a buying decision. At $2 a bottle and with the publicity this brand has received, this is not a barrier and peripheral wine consumers can feel confident buying this product. Only time will tell if this whets people's palates for a better product at a higher price point. Also, would love to hear any opinions you have of Black Box Chardonnay in the other thread below. Wed Feb 26 05:08:57 -0800 2003 87352 0 Melanie Wong 3 87356 I guess I worry about how the rest of us who couldn't possibly produce wine (the actual liquid) for 20 cents a bottle can compete. Sure, it's a whole different ballgame, but still, their low prices are quite amazing. I agree, it's a great way for people who aren't quite sure about wine to get introduced to it. I've even heard of many long time wine drinkers stocking up at Chez TJ (no, not the Mt. View restaurant!) with carts full of 2 Buck Chuck. I've used bag-in-a-box wine, ironically from the Franzia label (their family name that was sold years ago to a competitor), to do cork experiments. That wine stays pretty fresh for a lot longer than 4 weeks. I had a box of Franzia Chablis that I opened and didn't quite finish. 6 months later I used up the rest of it, then compared it with a freshly opened box. There was virtually no difference. I'll be curious to hear more about the Black Box Chard. Maybe they call it that because it's indestructible? Wed Feb 26 05:42:10 -0800 2003 87354 0 ed k 2 87371 At the hospitality suite I ran this weekend we used three cases of it (mixed varieties -- the Chardonnay and the Cabernet seemed to be the favorites). I didn't try it (I was running on no sleep and figured even one glass of wine would render me either drunk or comatose). I did have a swig (killing the bottle [g]) of the Merlot, which I thought was okay, if overly fruity even for my fruit-loving palate. But mostly I listened to people commenting on it -- despite the "phenomenon" most of them hadn't heard of it and were shocked when they complimented the wine and I told them the price (my mother, a fairly sophisticated wine drinker, among them). As I reported on the general topics board, it seemed to attract a fair number of people who were not regular wine drinkers (beer consumption was way down from the same event in the past). But even the regular wine drinkers enjoyed it and definitely thought it was a cut above the usual cheap party wine. That's really the bottom line -- the price might get people to buy it, but once they've bought it they have to enjoy it. It's not that there haven't been $2 wines in the past, but very few of them were as drinkable as the Charles Shaw wines. As for whether people introduced to wines by Charles Shaw will move on to higher grade wines, the white Zinfandel phenomenon suggests that a significant number of them will. Wed Feb 26 12:55:14 -0800 2003 87352 0 Ruth Lafler 1 87367 Anything with the name "Franzia" associated with it has a lot of baggage to overcome with us old-timers. Back in my beatnik days, we drank Red Mountain wine by the gallon (straight from the jug, using the pinky-and-elbow lifting technique). It was $1.50 per gallon, or 50 cents for a full quart. Franzia made a competing screw-top, which, however, we all considered TOTALLY beneath us, no matter how much funny stuff we smoked or how many peyote buttons we chewed up. The Franzia "Sauterne" in particular, as I recall it, was what you might call coffee pot cleaner grade wine. Wed Feb 26 11:54:24 -0800 2003 87351 0 Gary Soup 2 87372 Aaahh! Deja vu time. Red Mountain. Vino Paisano. Vino da Tavola. And for grander occasions, Almaden Grenache Rose. And don't forget those Italian-style table wines sold by a couple of little outfits in North Beach. Wed Feb 26 12:56:40 -0800 2003 87367 0 Sharuf 1 87448 I read about "Two-Buck Chuck," and bought some Merlot at TJ's. How bad could it be? So I thought, and then found out. Gag! A couple sips and I dumped the rest down the sink. "What do you expect for two bucks?" my wife asked. Not much, apparently. Wed Feb 26 21:54:56 -0800 2003 87351 0 gimpeaux 2 87470 Yeah, I didn't much like it either, even for two dollars. On the other hand, I did think the 2000 Cabernet and the 2001 Chardonnay were two-dollars good. (For the cab, even $6 good, maybe). For sure good enough for stews. Thu Feb 27 02:03:28 -0800 2003 87448 0 ericf 2 87490 Sometimes, a two-buck wine can be improved with decanting. Thu Feb 27 12:28:26 -0800 2003 87448 0 Cynthia 2 87567 I like the merlot. I went back and got another case yesterday. So there! Anyway, I don't care much for cabernet. Fri Feb 28 11:43:53 -0800 2003 87448 0 Sharuf