202550 Sun Jul 20 22:30:14 -0700 2003 31 18 Manhattan 0 1079819 Cotan is the best kept Sushi secret in NYC. How come they haven't been on the Zagat for years. Cotan is almost as good as Tomoe with no line. Try their raw octopus sushi. Sun Jul 20 22:30:14 -0700 2003 0 astoria 1 1079822 address please prices? Sun Jul 20 23:29:39 -0700 2003 1079819 0 bruce 2 1079826 COTAN RESTAURANT 121 W. Third St., New York, NY 10012 / TEL: (212)677-2370 It's on the same block with the Blue Note. Price is about 20-30% cheaper than Tomoe. Me and two friends had some sushi and drinks. We paid $150 including $5 tip for sushi chef. We were stuffed. Mon Jul 21 07:49:44 -0700 2003 1079822 0 astoria 3 1079862 What else is good there beside sushi? Is the sashimi worth to go for? Is it high quality? Mon Jul 21 11:26:54 -0700 2003 1079826 0 Isabelle 4 1079871 If sushi is good, sashimi is good, too. It's fresh and high quality. They have several fish that Tomoe doesn't have (maybe direct import from Japan). Good price. Sit at the counter and ask the sushi chef what's good today. Mon Jul 21 12:24:11 -0700 2003 1079862 0 astoria 5 1079874 Thank's for the scoop! To be honest with you, I've never been to Tomoe but I went to Yama and didn't like it...I feel it's americanized sushi, with sushi being served so big like a "burger"..which is definitely not authentic. So far in NYC, for sashimi and sushi, I like jewel bako, sushi of gari, yasuda and kuruma. How does Cotan compared to them? I know the price is cheaper so you might not be able to compared but I'll give it a try. Mon Jul 21 12:47:32 -0700 2003 1079871 0 Isabelle 6 1079881 I've only been to the Jewel Bako. Cotan is a 30% price discount of Jewel Bako with as good as or better quality Sushi with no fancy decor (or extreme snobbiness), although I respect the Jewel Bako's uniqueness and quality. Cotan has good Sake selections too. Sushi at Cotan is not a giant Yama-american sized (although I like Yama sometimes). It's rather small and fits right in your mouth. You don't have to eat half piece and then eat the rest. Mon Jul 21 13:28:53 -0700 2003 1079874 0 astoria 7 1080008 Cotan is a nice neighborhood place. It's well priced for what it is. But to compare the quality of the fish to Jewel Bako is absurd, in my opinion. Mon Jul 21 22:04:26 -0700 2003 1079881 0 Nina 8 1080024 I'm not very impressed with the Jewel Bako. Some fancy sushi restaurants have many japanese import fishes. However, the best sushi restaurants in Japan uses mostly or only the local catch of the day fishes. It takes several days for the fish to get here from Japan since they were caught. It isn't that fresh compare to local catch in the U.S. Tomoe is great because they seem like they always use fresh local catch rather than fancy imported (and not that fresh) fish from Japan. That's my opinion. Tue Jul 22 05:22:26 -0700 2003 1080008 0 astoria 9 1080060 Jewel Bako uses fish from all over the place - all over the world, actually. Japan, US - and lots more. And it's impeccably fresh. Tue Jul 22 10:43:54 -0700 2003 1080024 0 Nina 10 1080069 Jewel Bako is definitely one of the top sushi joint in NYC, but I just prefer Tomoe or Cotan. Tue Jul 22 11:04:18 -0700 2003 1080060 0 astoria 11 1080070 That's fine, of course - but I'm of the opinion (and this is pretty objective, based on lots of experience), that the fish as Tomoe and Cotan, while good, is not at the level of Jewel Bako, Yasuda, Gari, Kuruma, Seki, Blue Ribbon... I also find the knife skills at Tomoe to be beneath the level of those mentioned above, as well. Tue Jul 22 11:06:45 -0700 2003 1080069 0 Nina 12 1080195 Is Jewel Bako really in the New York top tier? I haven't been, but I was under the impression from friends that it's just a solid mid-level sushi experience in a really nice atmosphere. Tue Jul 22 21:42:35 -0700 2003 1080070 0 Peter Cuce 13 1080200 Jewel Bako is very definitely in the top tier! I put it right there with Yasuda, Kuruma, Gari - probably ahead of Gari, actually. Tue Jul 22 23:38:16 -0700 2003 1080195 0 Nina 14 1080202 I find that extremely hard to believe but can't refute it until I try it myself. But I know you have to have the last word... Tue Jul 22 23:47:16 -0700 2003 1080200 0 Peter Cuce 15 1080206 had the sushi at both gari and jewel bako. i prefer gari's... Wed Jul 23 00:04:58 -0700 2003 1080202 0 halo 16 1080208 How about Cotan? Wed Jul 23 00:21:38 -0700 2003 1080206 0 astoria 15 1080213 Abby? Suzanne? Hello? Wed Jul 23 02:21:08 -0700 2003 1080202 0 Nina 16 1080271 I can only put it this way. When I want to blow a wad of cash on sushi and sashimi, I think no farther than Jewel Bako. Wed Jul 23 10:44:34 -0700 2003 1080213 0 Abbylovi 15 1080214 Don't knock it 'til you've tried it. Abby, Suzanne and I had an extraordinary meal at JB last week. Every mouthful was a treat. Interesting, fresh fish. Beautifully executed. Watching the chef's hands was like watching a ballet. But hey - don't go - it's a small bar - it's hard enough as it is to get reservations :-) And read the OA and eG posts on JB, why don'tcha? :-) Wed Jul 23 02:23:19 -0700 2003 1080202 0 Nina 16 1080215 I wasn't knocking it, just asking a question. Anyway, my last comment was meant tongue-in-cheekly. I forgot my smiley next to the 'last word' part. ;) Wed Jul 23 02:44:01 -0700 2003 1080214 0 Peter Cuce 16 1080241 overeaters anonymous? Wed Jul 23 09:16:31 -0700 2003 1080214 0 jen kalb 16 1080245 Opinionated About - another (not open to the public) food site. Wed Jul 23 09:34:47 -0700 2003 1080214 0 Nina 13 1080209 Your description is exactly how I see it. Very disappointed by my most recent experience there of two weeks ago. Some great pieces of fish but... I would have been happier at iso I think not to mention kuruma, yasuda etc..... Wed Jul 23 00:34:25 -0700 2003 1080195 0 djk 9 1080104 Now I may be mistaken - and hopefully someone will clairfy - but I don't think one would ever get fish in an NYC restaurant that has NOT been frozen. I know you see gasping victims in chinatown markets, (I don't know - i don't want to know) but at a real restaurant buying for a premium supplier wouldn't the fish be flash frozen? I understand your point about local fish etc. but it seems that the size of the industry and the practices guarantee that the fish you eat today was caught, at best, yesterday. I have seen the trucks start arriving at Fulton at 11:00PM, the market 'opens' at 4 - right? It seems to me that any fish one eats in a restaurant or from a monger has been out of the water for at least 24 hours. Once it is frozed it can be air shipped or trucked - doesn't matter I guess. We ate at Tvier Fiskar in Reykjavik and the owner told/sold us about his fresh oysters flown from Ireland twice a week. My point being that from a health and business perspective, there is no 'catch of the day' anymore (freezing is a precaution against decay and bacteria - I believe) I enjoyed my jewel bako experience way more than my broolyn blue ribbon experience but neither compared to my Kuruma Zushi experience where I had truly divine sweet shrimp and even as fresh as his stuff was I still can't think that it was any more local or fresher than anyone elses. Where would you get sweet shrimp that is 'local' to NYC? I will cross post to "General Food" and hopefully branch the topic there. Tue Jul 22 13:24:40 -0700 2003 1080024 0 fkerm 10 1080107 Last week at Jewel Bako, the large sweet shrimp were alive, swimming around in a small tank - killed before our eyes, and we were eating them less than 10 seconds later...now *that's* fresh! Tue Jul 22 13:35:47 -0700 2003 1080104 0 Nina 11 1080116 ....but do you think they were NYC farmed shrimp? were they wearing black? or have cell phones? These are tell tale signs of nyc farmed fish.... Just curious - did you ask where they were from? (not that I would, maybe in the future i will) .And of course lobsters, and most shellfish are kept unfrozen, usually, then again I am looking for clarfication here. Tue Jul 22 13:55:29 -0700 2003 1080107 0 fkerm 12 1080436 just about spewed my tea on the monitor reading your description of nyc farmed shrimp... The questions and points you have are valid. The seafood industry is global but also very complex with spaces for independent entreprenuers [sp?]. When I lived in New Orleans I had several in the fishing industry among my acquaintances. The two most successful were one who was very happy to solidify a relationship with Japanese buyers (someone's comment about "from Japan" fish conjured up an image of fish going from US to Japan and back again) and one who did quite well going fishing with his brother and then offering first pick from his catch to local premium restaurants and selling the rest to friends and friends of friends. when i have more time I will go look to see if your thread on general topics has bloomed. cheers. wrayb Thu Jul 24 09:54:08 -0700 2003 1080116 0 wrayb 9 1080170 http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_174759.html Examples of sushi restaurants in Japan that uses fresh local catch.   http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_166467.html http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_174275.html http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_162546.html http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_164348.html http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_173276.html http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_173332.html http://www3.tokai.or.jp/computer/susikatu/ http://www.jalan.net/kanko/SPT_174758.html   Please use; http://www.systranbox.com/systran/box for translation.   Of course, tuna is always frozen. Don't eat tuna (or any big fish) too much because it's loaded with mercury. Have you ever had a headache splurging for many pieces of Toro? Tue Jul 22 18:16:40 -0700 2003 1080024 0 astoria 10 1080175 The headache was probably caused more by an excess of histamine than mercury. Link: http://abcnews.go.com/sections/living/DailyNews/tuna010313.html Tue Jul 22 18:34:31 -0700 2003 1080170 0 Chris G. 1 1079832 I don't know Cotan personally, but have not always heard such great things...it has been a while however....have others had similar positive experiences? Mon Jul 21 08:43:29 -0700 2003 1079819 0 Lee K 1 1079841 I believe Jim Leff wrote about Cotan a few months ago... Mon Jul 21 10:12:30 -0700 2003 1079819 0 Nina