Red Lobster
Red Lobster has finally arrived, they're opening up in Times Square in the next few months. Now, before you start bashing it, think about it: there's enough room in this town for black cod in miso at Nobu AND steak and shrimp for $13.95.
I think it's ironic that New York, in its attempt to be cutting-edge and different, has neglected ordinary, cheap food, seafood in particular. Where can you go in this city for all you can eat shrimp for under 15 bucks? Where can I order a fried seafood platter without breaking the bank?
I SAY, LET THERE BE LOBSTERFEST!!
Mistersmuckers
May 07, 2003 09:47PM
You are not alone (although it sure seems like it sometimes).
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I know I'm excited about crab legs and hush puppies, and not the overpriced ones at the mediocre City Crab.
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listen, the first time i ever had popcorn shrimp was at da'lobster and this was 20 years ago. who sez they're not trendsetters!
ali
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Try Johnny's Reef on City Island.
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when i was a kid on LI the folks would take me to the red lobster in stonybrook...even then i would order the chicken. i do like the garlic/cheese biscuits though. i took my wife to the red lobster in huntington on our 1st date back in '88. it's a car dealer now.
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I agree that the cheese biscuits are the only thing at Red Lobster worth eating. In fact, my brother and I throw around the Seinfeldian proposition to just go in to the restaurant, ask a table for their biscuits, and leave. Unfortunately neither of us has had the guts to carry through with that one yet.
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Recall, though, that even the Applebee's in Times Square charges a $3 premium on its dishes compared with what they would be in the 'burbs. I have a sneaking feeling that the Lobster will do the same. Mind you, AYCE shrimp for under $20 is still a deal in this town. But it galls just a little, all the same.
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tell me about it! My boyfriend and I had lunch the other day at the TGI Friday's downtown by the world trade center, and were shocked at the prices. Sandwiches were around $15! I'm sure they're not that much in the 'burbs.
As a point of reference, we had lunch a week later at Les Halles downtown and it was slightly cheaper, for much better food!
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I got no bones to pick with Red Lobster. but wow, $15 bucks for a sandwich is steep for chain food.
I went to Above in Hilton on 42nd last week (around the corner from the new Times Square place) and had a very tasty and fresh lobster roll with a big pile of fresh cut fries for $16 (and it a very big lobster serving on a scrumptious roll, they bread, delicate breadsticks and sweet butter they serve before meal is good too).
(that said - I will be checking out new branch for whole lobster specials and hitting for lunch in near future.)
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I've been to both the Friday's you've been to and the one in Times Square (both with out of town friends who have no adventurous spirit) and believe it or not the Times Square branch is even *pricier* than the one by the WTC site by about another $2-3 a dish, I was shocked at the prices. Can easily see the $13.95 Red Lobster special being $20 in Times Square. Stickin' to Ollie's when in that situation from now on.
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As a chow snob I'm tempted to request we move a thread about Red Lobster containing a mention of TGIFridays to the NOT ABOUT FOOD board since the back of the house boil a bag procedure doesn't warrant a chowhound-worthy discussion...the same discussion happened just before Olive Garden opened, but I'm REAL surprised to see so much support for R.L. here - what the hell?
It's ridiculous to consider (reactionary, etc), but isn't there an obvious hypothetical threat to indie seafood places lurking here? Granted Olive Garden hasn't forced LUPA to close, but there's a cheapening effect nonetheless, namely in the fact that by contributing to this discussion I have to put those two restaurants in the same sentence...
If quantity (AYCE) is what you seek over quality (i.e. COOKED TO ORDER) then by all means go and spend your money on cookie cutter breaded frozen shrimp. But to atone for your "sin" (said in jest, yall) ALSO go to Mary's Fish Camp and get the salt shrimp. Go to Svennigsens and get the seafood chowder. Go to Schaffer City or Grand Central and get your oyster fix. Just because corporations have dumbed down food doesn't mean we have to be dumb and eat it.
I'm tempted to invoke the argument that, like barbecue and tex-mex some things just can't be/shouldn't be had in the city at restaurants. Why try to bring suburbia in too? What's the attraction to being able to get it on 42nd Street AND at your local mall in L.I. or Jersey?
A warning - if people choose to write in response to this, try to keep it as Manhattan food centric as possible...the best way to combat a place like R.L. is to offer as many suggestions for other seafood places in the city (Manhattan) where deliciousness can be found as opposed to deliciousness being compromised so you can save a few dollars...
THM
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whoa dude chill
i'm sure all those places you mentioned are awesome and i seriously doubt rl will put any of them in jeopardy
it is what it is
what's wrong with frozed breaded shrimp anyway?
lighten up and have some fun
;)
ali
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Some people find Red Lobster delicious. Go figure. But I really doubt that a Times Square RL is gonna steal business away from Aquagrill, Mary's Fish Camp, or any other "reputable," chowish seafood place!
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Let's face it, Times Square isn't really New York. Years ago there was a concentrated effort to turn it into Disney north. if chain restaurants opening up in Times Square pains some people, i'm afraid they should brace themselves for years of pain because this is just the start. there's an old saying "fish where the fish are" that's exactly what Red Lobster, Olive Garden et al. are doing in Times Square (sorry for the pun).
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Ah, there it is - I've been waiting for someone to say that Times Square isn't New York. You're right as far as I'm concerned, but I will put in 2 cents about Red Lobster. I can't imagine bothering to eat in the NYC branch even though I really do like their biscuits, BUT in the summer when I remove myself to Chautauqua county, well now that's a whole other story.
Chautauqua County is the westernmost county in New York State - beyond Buffalo, only a few miles short of Erie, PA, it's the last 3 exits off the New York State thruway before you hit the Pennsylvania line.
For as long as I've been going there, I've been saying, "By the end of a summer in Chautauqua, you think Red Lobster is a really good restaurant." I also say that I cook out there "in self-defense" as opposed to my life in NYC where I eat out more than in. In fact the Red Lobster in Lakewood, NY, a northern "suburb" of Jamestown (please don't laugh) is home to a variety of chain restaurants and that's as good as it gets out there.
The Lakewood Red Lobster has always been exceptionally well-run and clean with excellent unpretentious service. It's both friendly and competent. It's a very poor part of the state so a steady job at Red Lobster is good work; that's why they get good help.
There's a blind fellow who's been working there for a couple of days a week for years now. He lives at a shelter not far away and comes in to do the 'wrapping.' Knife and fork wrapped into a napkin sealed with a paper self-stick napkin ring. He'll spend several hours turning tubs of clean silverwear into tubs of ready to use set-ups.
I think he gets a small stipend, but he also gets companionship as the people who work there adore him, and all the regulars stop by for a little 'visit', and his hands just keep working away. He seems to be able to practically 'intuit' a utensil that's less than clean. There's always a little discard pile. I've watched him, he doesn't paw the working ends of things, but he does seem to sense when something's not as it should be. After all these years, it's a sixth sense I guess. Of course, he always gets lunch too.
I've been going there through the tenures of about 3 managers. Each was excellent and each has gone on to a much higher postion in the company.
What to eat there? The steamed crab - tell them to take it out just a couple of seconds 'early' so they don't overcook it. The plain grilled fish. Some of the shrimpy, crabby sorts of pastas. I've always found their salads crisp and fresh. Their special shrimp things tend to be swimming in too much butter/margerine for my taste, but that's me. I just skip the hyperfatty dishes.
Will I go in Manhattan? No. Am I bursting with gratitude and happiness that it's in Lakewood? You bet!
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I don't think Mary's Fish Camp has anything to worry about. I have eaten at Mary's and Blue Water and other places and they're all fine. But sometimes you don't want to drop $50 for dinner; sometimes, you just want a quick fix. That's what RL is for.
In the same vein, why shop at the Gap when you can shop at the boutiques in SoHo? The reason is because people like myself can't always afford to splurge, nor do I want to. That's just not reality.
There's no 'dumbing down' going on here -- Mary's isn't going to suddenly start serving the same shrimp scampi as RL. But what it does mean is that now we have more choices, that's all.
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I read you loud and clear, MrSmuckers - of course, AFTER I posted my latest to your other response...
:)
Sigh - that's a mssg board for you....
Fun conversation - thanks for bringing it up - it just goes to show Times Square is it's own separate Borough...
THM
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It will be interesting to see what happens once they open up. Who knows, maybe it won't work and they'll wind up running out of NY with their tail between their legs? We shall see.
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Yeah.... just like McDonald's, Starbucks, and KMart.
Why can't they be more like 7-Eleven?
And why are there no 7-Elevens in Manhattan?
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I just hate that chains, especially restaurants, are opening up in NYC. Our restaurants are one (big) of the many reasons we stand out as the best city in the world (yeah, that's right, damnit). If all these chains open up, it cheapens the city, waters down the experience and begins to turn us into Anytown, USA before you know it. Look at every single mall in the country - same stores in each one. Would you like NYC and every other city to have the same.
And, by the way, I'm sure there are many good places in NYC for resonable seafood, and especially in the "outer boroughs." You might just be focusing on "acclaimed" and well known establishments.
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This city has maintaned its character through far worse threats than Red Lobster, so I am sure we will remain The-Farthest-Thing-From-Anytown-USA for the forseeable future. Barring Red Lobster deploying its shrimp boats it always advertises about in a food embargo against New York harbor, I think we can all breathe easy that other New York restaurants will survive. (We have K-Marts and Best Buys and somehow retail survives- I even heard those heathens in Queens have Costco's, Home Depot's, and Targets. Can you imagine?- how pedestrian!
More generally on this topic, I support those who can proudly state that they enjoy a fried frozen all you can eat shrimp marathon -cheers. I have eaten some crazy, delicious uber-chowhound grub from places I learned of from this board, but I still retain a lot of hidden guilty anti-chow faves of which I will not speak. Why ridicule someone over Lobsterfest? I've got bigger fish to fry- knuk,knuk,knuk.
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why eat at Red Lobster if you can eat at Pearl Oyster Bar or Mary's Fish Camp? if i want to eat franchise seafood, i can always go to New Jersey or Long Island.
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That's really not the point. I eat at Mary's Fish Camp, but I certainly cannot afford to pay $20 for a lobster roll all the time, nor do I want to. People should be able to choose whether they want to eat gourmet or low-budget. And I shouldn't have to go all the way to NJ for that, either.
Part of enjoying good food is finding good value. I've eaten at many excellent seafood places that were worth the money, and I've also eaten at many horribly overpriced seafood places that weren't. Perhaps the presence of RL will make other restaurants rethink whether they are offering a good enough bang for the buck or not.
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Ooo...for fear I'm going to break my own rule, I'll try to keep this tame...You almost won me over with the first part of your post, but that last line ignited my cockles.
I applaud you going to MFC and Pearl and wherever else for quality seafood, they're great restaurants and you've obviously got good enough taste to recognize good eats. And contrary to my other post, I'm not so much of a snob that I can't be won over by the comfort food yumminess of a bucketload of fried goodness.
But you don't have to be an economics major to figure out the fallacy of saying places like MFC and Pearl are "gouging" you compared to the "great deals" you can get at R.L. A chain with multiple locations can afford to take the loss on rent and insurance Red Lobster Corp. will most certainly incur by opening a flagship T.Sq branch. The other restaurants mentioned are also in touristy locations (W.V., Empire State Bldg), probably pay exorbitant rents too but don't have the economic power of a corporation to bail them out, especially in our weak economic atmosphere.
Argue for the right to eat the food, fine, I'm totally down with that (even to the point of craving AYCE shrimp now!). But please don't posit that any of the little guys can learn from the big guys in how to run their businesses. This is how justification leads to acceptance leads to demand leads to complete domination of the market.
End of Rant: A couple other alternatives to R.L. I thought of - A Salt and Battery (two locations); Chinatown! (where all manner of waterbeast can be had for cheap cheap at a TON of places (Fuleen Seafood, Pings, Funky Broome, just to name a few...)), Francisco's Centro Vasco...
And on the more expensive side: Avra, RM, Oceana, Le Bernadin...
The list is endless...let's hope it stays that way...
THM
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An Irish friend of mine almost died when he heard I had spent $11 for fish and chips at Salt N Battery - he thought me a fool. While I thought the fish was good, the chips were heavy laden - I think I would prefer more of a Belgin style frite.
Mind you - I'm not going to eat fish and chips every day.
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An Irish friend of mine almost died when he heard I had spent $11 for fish and chips at Salt N Battery - he thought me a fool. While I thought the fish was good, the chips were heavy laden - I think I would prefer more of a Belgin style frite.
Mind you - I'm not going to eat fish and chips every day.
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I am not at all convinced that Red Lobster is a better value. It may be cheaper, but I do not believe it is good enough that dollar for dollar you are getting "more." Each meal I have had there recently (my dad loves it, so we go) has been outrageously salty and very overcooked.
And I don't recall all-you-can-eat deals, though they do have deals where you get 36 shrimp (12 fried, 12 scampi, 12 other).
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to add to the point that Mary's is quite a viable option... I work on the same block as Red Lobster/Times Square and have jumped on the 1/9 train (entrance is also on 42nd St) several times at 2:00-sih and have gone down to Mary's (no wait!) and had lobster (roll, knuckles, whole) and have been back to my office in about an hour. There whole lobster lunch is under $20.
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i always see 'shrimpfest' commercials, and frankly, all you can peel & eat for 12.95 sounds like a killer deal. i'll be there, once at least (in wyoming, we didn't have red lobster!)
i need a shrimp festival in my life every once in a while! i'm looking forward to it, actually.
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Why are people comparing Red Lobster with Marys Fish Camp, Pearl Oyster Bar, etc. Isnt Red Lobster's stuff frozen?
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yes the RED LOBSTER stuff is mostly frozen, except for the lobsters which are live. my brother worked there for awhile and he swore they screamed when they went to their doom into the steamer oven.
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In the smallish southern city where I went to university, there were far fewer choices than in New York City. Even there, Red Lobster was mediocre at best. One of my family members lived nearby, and his pre-teen son would eat out at only two places: Chili's and Red Lobster. When they visited, we ate at Red Lobster a lot. My feelings were that the famous cheese rolls were doughy, characterless and oily. The fish was invariably overcooked, and not of really great quality before it was cooked. I didn't say anything because the poor thirteen year old was awkward enough without a college student making fun of his food choices.
Look, I agree that New York suffers from a lack of good fried, low-end fish places, but trek out to the Chip Shop in Brooklyn or even City Island if you can make the trip rather than patronizing Red Lobster.
What New York really needs, and I've never found here, is a really good fried catfish place. In the town where I grew up, there's a place where you can get all you can eat spicy, cornmeal crusted catfish, crisp but light hushpuppies, vinegary coleslaw, and sweet tea for $5.99. It's all homemade.
If New York had that, even for $10.99, I'd be there once a week.
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here in the city you need to go to a cajun restaurant to get fried catfish and believe me you will not be paying 5.99
ali
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You used to be able to get pretty good fried catfish at the fish shop on the corner of 118 and 8th Ave for very reasonable price. Take the B or C train to 116th St, and walk up two blocks. I don't remember the name of the shop. I haven't been in a year, but it used to be good.
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I Believe I live in the only town where a Red Lobster has actually gone out of busines. This pre-made crap is horrible! You may be able to sell frozen shrimp in Times Square. But this is no indication of quality.They will foist "special" upon "special" upon the public, until they will just froth at the mouth and swallow anything including this crap.
I can walk into a gas station and get better seafood than this chain offers! Make this abomination pay the price!
If you want pre-frozen seafood go to the Ho-Jo and get some clams!
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lol
howard johnson's frozen fried clams are awesome!
now you have me frothing at the mouth!
ali
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When I was living on a Lakota Sioux reservation in South Dakota in the 90s, I was adopted by a full-blood Chief. He was in his 70's but loved to drive all over South Dakota in his station wagon. When one of his kids celebrated a birthday, he would take them to the restaurant of their choice. His grandson was particularly fond of The Great Wall (Chinese of course) in Rapid City, a nice distance away. But the Chief looked forward to it. He would order fried rice and watch everyone else eat Chinese.
After my adoption I was now allowed one choice of any restaurant in South Dakota. Well, you guessed it. THE RED LOBSTER in Rapid City. And that's where we went. He had never seen Lobster before and wasn't thrilled with what arrived on our table that night. He was just bewildered why anyone would want to eat something that came out of a red shell. So he ate some fish (Walleye) and I dug into my Lobster and Shrimp.
Yes, indeed. RED LOBSTER is wayyyyy overdue in this city. I'm sure I'll see a lot of my fellow hounds in line when it opens. I love their food.
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Go down to Chinatown, pick up 3 - 1 1/4 lb lobsters for $19.99, and cook them yourself, they'll be better and cheaper and not just coated in butter to cover up the lack of taste and freezer burn.
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I disagree with your statement that NYC has "neglected ordinary cheap food". We've got TGI Friday's if you want REALLY ordinary cheap food. They probably even have a fried seafood platter. I'd say Friday's is just about as bad as Red Lobster and in the same price range. Also virtually every Chinese restaurant in and outside Chinatown offers fried seafood - as well as lobster and lots of other seafood choices - that's pretty affordable. No need for Red Lobster in this town.
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