199915 Tue Mar 04 16:46:18 -0800 2003 22 18 Manhattan 0 1066083 Okay, chowhounds, let's come up with five distinctive New York foods; things that maybe you can find elsewhere, but really are New York. For example: Black and White Cookie, Comidas Chinas/Latinas, Bagel with lox, Egg cream, calzone, lemon ice. . .others? Tue Mar 04 16:46:18 -0800 2003 0 Brian 1 1066088 When I was in college in Rochester we drove six hours overnight to get New York cheesecake to get us through finals so to me New York will always be THE place for cheesecake. Tue Mar 04 17:01:09 -0800 2003 1066083 0 SJ 2 1066125 Junior's cheesecake? Or any cheesecake? Tue Mar 04 19:30:10 -0800 2003 1066088 0 Brian 3 1066188 Actually it was Lindy's. Several years later my first grad. school internship turned out to be 2 blocks from Junior's and that's when I knew I had "seen the (cheesecake) light." Wed Mar 05 11:13:18 -0800 2003 1066125 0 SJ 4 1066249 Cascon in Whitestone Queens is also GREAT! Wed Mar 05 17:05:34 -0800 2003 1066188 0 billyblancoNYC 1 1066111 Pizza. Tue Mar 04 18:10:15 -0800 2003 1066083 0 Steve 2 1066148 Not if you've ever been to Italy. Tue Mar 04 23:46:10 -0800 2003 1066111 0 Chris G. 3 1066233 It still says, "New York." BTW, I lived in Rome for a while. Wed Mar 05 15:47:09 -0800 2003 1066148 0 Steve 1 1066150 Egg on a roll, regular coffee, please. Wed Mar 05 00:11:37 -0800 2003 1066083 0 haochi 1 1066158 NY may have perfected certain recipies, but it does not, sadly, have an native cuisine. The first restaurants in NY were French (e.g., Delmonico's), closely followed by German beer-hall steakhouses (e.g., Peter Luger). The Italian and Irish immigrants of the early 20th century left there mark as well, as have the waves of subsequent groups. Wed Mar 05 05:45:01 -0800 2003 1066083 0 Mogsob 2 1066159 I have to agree. New York food is ALL food. Wed Mar 05 06:07:11 -0800 2003 1066158 0 dude 2 1066201 There are a few dishes that I think are fairly native to NY. However, they are not done in many places in NYC, anymore. See the Oyster Bar posting above and the NY Times article for its comments regardins oyster stews and pan roasts. Where does "Manhattan Clam Chowder" come from? But just try to find it IN MANHATTAN and done really well. New York and its waves of immigrants have also brought dishes that were changed here, such as pizza as we know it. Some dishes like these have definite NYC origins, but are easily found in lots of places and tough to find special examples in NY. Maybe part of the old NY cultre has, or is being, lost. Wed Mar 05 12:04:21 -0800 2003 1066158 0 Captain 1 1066162 Typical New York City foods that come to mind are foods one can usually eat on the run. Until I started traveling, I did not realize that people from other U.S. cities and/or European countries do not eat food on the street. When I first visited France, I was told it was bad manners (except for perhaps ice cream) to walk and eat on the street. Anyway, here are my 'typical' choices; though they can be had elsewhere they are firmly connected to New York eats. hot dogs pizza pastrami and corned beef sandwiches with mustard (not mayo!) egg cream seltzer (though it's called club soda everywhere else) Wed Mar 05 07:59:14 -0800 2003 1066083 0 Flynn 2 1066396 You are right! LOL When my mother-in-law visited from France, she was so surprised that whenever we were walking around I was munching on something- pizza,egg rolls, bagels... she is def. not snobby,nor is my husband, but when they eat, they must be sitting, at the table! And, when our friends from Mississippi send us 'Southern food" in a basket each Chritmas, we are sending them H& H bagels . Our friends from France wanted to go to Katz's- they were obsessed with seeing the pickles and having a pastrami/rye sandwich(or as some say-"sangwitch!") Thu Mar 06 13:39:16 -0800 2003 1066162 0 le bouquin 2 1066411 Club soda and seltzer are not the same. Club soda has a small amount of sodium bicarbonate added, along with some other stuff, which is why you sometimes see "sodium-free" on seltzer bottles. Thu Mar 06 14:54:46 -0800 2003 1066162 0 lucia 1 1066175 hot pretzels italian ice Wed Mar 05 10:26:01 -0800 2003 1066083 0 sourpatch 1 1066300 The roots of the NYC food are from other parts of the world. The typical NYC food, good and bad, that comes to my mind is: GOOD ---- The endless fantastic verity of ethnic food (Chinese food dominates). Good Pizzas - only few! Chinese food – all levels. Jewish Deli Food - Corned Beef, Hot Pastrami on Rye with mustard, Matzo ball soup, Knishes, Smoked Fish (Salmon, Whitefish, Sturgeon Sable), herring in red wine sauce (hamm..), schmaltz herring, Bagels, Bialys, Pretzels, Rugelach, Coleslaw with Mayonnaise Salad (usually lousy), Bagel with Cream Cheese & Lox , Cream Cheese with scallion (and other cream cheese variations), pickles (NY style) Peter Luger Steaks Oysters at Oyster Bar Hole-in-the-wall excellent sushi. BAD --- Lousy Delis with open food bars. Freshness and sanitation is not a strong side of these establishments. Endless amounts of bad pizzas overdosed with lousy cheese and scary toppings (there are only FEW good pizzas in NYC!). The New York inferior version of Italian food (most of the NYC Italian food!). There is of course good Italian as well. Lousy hot dogs (the meaty tasteless stick inside the bland bun resembles real FRANKFURTERs only in its shape). Lousy coffee in general. Starbucks raised the bar but not enough. Lousy cakes (with few expensive exceptions) – NYC doesn’t know how to bake cakes. Bread is another story – you can find, quite easily, excellent bread in Manhattan. Thu Mar 06 00:32:36 -0800 2003 1066083 0 YSChow 2 1066303 I like your list. One addition to the Bad Things: Fried Stuff. New York is a horribe, horrible town for frying. .with exceptions, of course. And it's the plentiful exceptions to everything that is NYC's BEST trait! Thu Mar 06 00:50:04 -0800 2003 1066300 0 Jim Leff 3 1066359 Wow, I am really exited to be honored by a complement from you, Jim Leff, the father of the most fantastic food Message Board in the world, a phenomenon (one of many) that makes the Greater New York City such a great place to live in (although there are CHOWHOUND boards for other cities as well). I LOVE your food writing and swiping passion for food. Thanks to you I was transformed to China by going to the Chinese Food Court in Flushing and to Afghanistan by going to the Afghani bakery in Jackson Heights (just two samples). I second you with the HORIBLE *fried stuff* and with the EXCEPTIONS (of good food) phenomenon and I would add TRANSFORMATIONs. I tell my friends that the greater NYC seems to me as an urban mass of gray buildings, garbage & traffic with many hidden flakes of silver and gold, and few diamonds. You just have to know how to find those treasures and that’s SO EXCITING. Of course you suffer many wounds during food explorations (the MANY lousy ethnic traps) but the good discoveries make it worthwhile. The magnificent transformations from one ethnicity to another, from lousiness to supreme excellence, from darkness to light, from massive traffic to the inner coziness of hidden restaurants (and art/music institutions as well), some of them with tiny backyards surrounded by monstrous walls of unattractive buildings (of course there some nice buildings), from (culinary) hell to heaven, The mingling of ugliness and beauty, good and bad taste, noise and behind-the-wall-quietness, the endless variety of everything (…food, of course….and art...and money…and the lack of money… and business…and buildings & bridges…and the CHOWHOUNDS) – that’s what makes Manhattan and the greater NYC the most fascinating urban and culinary area in the world. NYC is both the worst and the most beautiful thing that man has done to earth…and to the culinary experience. You go to Italy. You eat fantastic Italian food but you get board very soon. How much excellent pasta, supreme Prosciutto and Chingiale stews (wild boar) can you eat without having a good sushi, good Chinese, good Thai, good South American, good Jewish delis, good Middle Eastern, challenging Korean, Indian and many other types of food? And more about TRANSFORMATIONs – what is more fascinating than to get down from the elevated trains (such as in Jackson Heights, Brighton Beach and others) or to drive underneath, and to discover the intensive life and food world under the rails? Walking there and eating with the background sound of the passing trains is a New York unique experience. My logic says that the areas under the elevated trains should have been deserted of human life and especially of food but the opposite is happening and this is amazing. The stinking aroma of many New York restaurants that paradoxically serve excellent food and the fact that I am still alive after eating in many of these places, as well as the top food temples of genius chefs, is a miracle by itself. Love you badly (Food is love. I am a married straight male) YS Thu Mar 06 11:31:21 -0800 2003 1066303 0 YSChow 4 1066445 Thanks, but there are many accomplished hounds and compelling writers on this board, YSChow. I'm pleased to be one of the pack! "(the MANY lousy ethnic traps)" MOST restaurants are lousy traps. No price range or cuisine dominates when it comes to disappointment. As you know, it's all about finding wonderful exceptions and hold-outs; places where people cook with skill, pride, and love. In every genre! ciao Thu Mar 06 17:08:29 -0800 2003 1066359 0 Jim Leff 5 1066468 Agree. Thu Mar 06 18:59:00 -0800 2003 1066445 0 YSChow 1 1066390 As a non-new yorker....born and raised in Connecticut. I go to NY for the food. First and foremost, NY food is CHOICE. I'm from the non NY side of CT and we really don't have choice here. My list of NY food: Bagels Deli,deli,deli pastrami corned beef Chestnuts All the ethnic food choices!!! Egg cremes Pickles CHEESECAKE!!!!!!! These are the NY foods I bring home when I visit the City. Thu Mar 06 13:09:53 -0800 2003 1066083 0 lm 2 1066563 Hmmm, are we missing any? How about some of that street food: hot dogs, falafel, sausage and peppers, shish kebab. Is rice and beans with wonton soup New York food? Where else can you get that combo? What other foods say New York? Fri Mar 07 16:22:35 -0800 2003 1066390 0 Brian