122161 Mon Oct 27 17:50:49 -0800 2003 11 8 Midwest 0 664459 Can anyone recomend a good place for my first trip to Tulsa? Something that represents the local cusine? thanks Mon Oct 27 17:50:49 -0800 2003 0 surftel 1 664461 There are a couple of Tulsa threads on this board; it doesn't look promising: http://www.chowhound.com/midwest/boards/midwest/messages/5775.html Mon Oct 27 18:31:11 -0800 2003 664459 0 JimInLoganSquare 1 664463 Here are some other threads on Tulsa (the first 2 are recent): http://www.chowhound.com/southwest/boards/southwest/messages/8747.html http://www.chowhound.com/southwest/boards/southwest/messages/8495.html http://www.chowhound.com/southwest/boards/southwest/messages/7071.html http://www.chowhound.com/midwest/boards/midwest/messages/5240.html http://www.chowhound.com/midwest/boards/midwest/messages/6703.html If I were going to recommend just one dinner in Tulsa for "local cuisine," I'd send you to Jamil's, or one of the other Lebanese steakhouses recommended on these threads. And for lunch, go to Elmer's BBQ for a "Badwich" (Tulsa is decidedly a carnivore's town) or White River Fish Market for fried catfish. Over to you, Betty . . . Mon Oct 27 20:27:56 -0800 2003 664459 0 PayOrPlay 2 664479 Thanks, PayOrPlay, for looking these up. You know, I really need to do a bit more hounding when I get back to the smaller market midwestern cities, like Tulsa (in-laws) and Omaha (parents). It seems like whenever these Tulsa questions come up, we recycle the same old threads. Are there any Tulsa 'hounds out there (besides Betty) who can report on some fresh finds? Cheers, Aaron Tue Oct 28 12:25:12 -0800 2003 664463 0 Aaron D 3 664554 I haven't had a chance to carefully read the other responses, so I'm sorry if I repeat anybody. If you like BBQ, I was recently taken to a truly local Tulsa place that you might like, I certainly did. My boyfriend has been going there for many many years, but it was totally new to me - Knotty Pine Barbeque, 3301 W. 5th Street. Right off Charles Page Blvd. That's right Tulsans, W. 5th Street. I checked to see if Yahoo offered a map, and it does. It is a very industrial slightly-abandoned looking part of town with wind-y streets as it is near the river. BBQ, pork, beef, maybe chicken, sausage and as always, smoked bolonga, on wax paper. I had pork and my tray was very very good, tender smoky meat, and good sides. Just the sort of place for a 'hound to find. It is easy to get there from Gilcrease Museum, but south of the interstate. (I hope you'll be there in time to see the Remington at Night exhibit, up til Nov. 6 I think) If you are on Peoria, you should stop for a root beer at Weber's bright orange stand. They've been making their own for generations. Also just off Peoria is an unassuming little Mexican place called La Hacienda. Yahoo still just shows the Sapulpa location. It's on the west side of Peoria, south of the Brookside, don't be suprised if it is in an old Pizza Hut (like sapulpa's) maybe you could ask somebody. I've eaten at the Sapulpa place and a S. California transplant friend loves the new Tulsa one. Along with the usual stuff they have fish tacos and pork gorditas and other things our usual Tex-Mex places don't all offer. Have a good visit and come back for more. Wed Oct 29 23:46:27 -0800 2003 664479 0 Betty 3 664558 Tulsa remains a problematic chow place. Something simply does not gel for the local eats scene. (At least you have Omaha which is entirely chow-friendly.) I think part of it is a predilection for "quick" eats by the majority of the locals. Food is something you do quickly while en route to something else. Not a chowhound philosophy. I've lived in the vicinity for 13 years(!) and my only RELIABLE standby in the entire city is India Place, 71st & Lewis for excellent (avoid the buffet) curries & tandoor in comfortable surroundings. It's very hard to define why the restaurants in this area (I'm thinking a sort of Lost World/Bermuda Triangle that runs from N Dallas 'burbs up through central Oklahoma to Tulsa) somehow just lacks some essential element. The aversion to alcohol may be part of it (alcohol tends to make you linger over your meal), but not entirely. There should be great BBQ in these parts and there isn't. Great steaks: ditto. I've eaten all over Tulsa (fancy places & dives) and in my memory cannot summon up one experience that made me want to return anywhere other than the Palace. Thu Oct 30 07:39:31 -0800 2003 664479 0 Mike 4 664565 I don't know Tulsa, too well, but it seems you're a little bit hard on the place. Of course, I haven't been stuck there for 13 years, so it's hard to say how quickly I'd tire of the places I do like. Though I'm not crazy about Freddy's, Jamil's, and the whole Lebanese steakhouse phenomenon, I think it's pretty cool and, in my experience, uniquely Tulsan. I've been to India Palace once, and I rather liked it, but it was a while back. Other places I look forward to returning are Ron's hamburgers and chili, Brownie's for burgers, Polo Grill for a nice dinner, Ricardo's for Tex-Mex, Brookside-by-Day for breakfast... I'm not saying these are world-class places, but I think they're all pretty good. And, for example, while I think Chicago has some of the best Mexican food in the country, you can't find good Tex-Mex chicken enchiladas anywhere. I know what you mean, though, about the food culture in Tulsa. I read a rave review in the World about Joe's Crab Shack when it opened. Cheddar's is packed every time I drive past. And in the meantime, other decent spots seem to open and close with regularity in seemingly fine locations--an Italian called Amore on 71st and Yale, and another pizza joint (Il Vicino? on Harvard? memory fades...) I don't understand how quality independent places don't garner the kind of business that some middle of the road chains can attract. Omaha suffers from the same thing. But I think that same culture, that lack of a critical mass of chowhounds as it were, makes it that much more difficult and imperative to seek out the good ones. I mean, there's just got to be some small mom-and-pop Mexican shops that make their own tortillas and serve up some tremendous food. But unfortunately, I'm rarely there long enough to seek them out. And it's too big a job for one person anyway--but I hope you and Betty and other Tulsa hounds will keep looking and keep posting about your new finds for the benefit of those who return only occasionally. Cheers, Aaron Thu Oct 30 11:28:49 -0800 2003 664558 0 Aaron D 5 664569 Aaron, I'm not a Jamil's fan at all, but I just wanted to add that the Lebanese steak & BBQ phenom kind of (in my mind) really started a few miles farther west, in Drumright. Joseph's used to be awesome but not so much now. Freddies (both around Drumright) is still a place I go once in awhile, mostly because they have hummous on the salad bar. They started during the early oilfield days when Drumright was a wild old place with oilwells as far as the eye could see, and pretty much did there own thing during prohibition. The newest incarnation, Freddie Paul's, in Stillwater, is trying hard. Same family. Tulsa's Mexican population is still very new. OKC however, has a much more established Mexican community and shopping areas, and is a much easier place to find ethnic food in general, although Tulsa's opportunities are improving. Remember that as cities go, Tulsa is very very young and in some ways still figuring out what it is. Thu Oct 30 12:58:44 -0800 2003 664565 0 Betty 6 664570 Thanks for the Lebanese steakhouse info--I really don't know much about it, beyond my utter surprise the first time I ate at Freddies (is that how it's spelled). Is that actually in Sapulpa? Near Sapulpa? Which is near Drumright? My Oklahoma geography is pretty poor. My Oklahoma history is pretty poor, too, but census records show over 100,000 people in the metro area in 1900, and I know that there was a ton of oil money and business there for a stretch. While it certainly doesn't have the history (or size) of east coast cities, or even midwestern cities like Chicago and St. Louis, it's been around long enough to have some good eating. And I'm not even sure a long history is a prerequisite for good eating. And I think Tulsa DOES have some good eating. Mostly I just rue not having the time to scope it out more when I'm in town, and I hope to encourage more Tulsans who read this board to a) do that exploring for me and b) post about it so I can have even better eats when I'm in town. And not just for me, but for others too. It's funny, I was just reading an article in the Omaha World-Herald about Connor Oberst's parents (he's the lead singer for Bright Eyes--one of a group of bands that has Omaha currently being hyped as an indie rock hot spot). The article was about how hip even his parents were because, among other things, his mom does yoga and eats Thai food. Point being, Thai food was written about as something still on the edge. So I'm not necessarily looking for food in Tulsa, Omaha, et al. that would be considered cutting edge in Chicago or New York or SF (though that's not to say that it couldn't exist). But those towns do have a lot of tradition, and even if it's a largely meat-and-potatoes tradition, than I'd love to find some good meat and potatoes. I do remember one good homestyle sort of place a bit outside Tulsa that served a killer fried apple pie or some such dish. I wish I could remember the name. It does really surprise me there's not better BBQ in Tulsa, though I think I went someplace in Macalster that was pretty good. In any case, I've got to believe the good stuff's to be found. And Betty, I appreciate your work in finding it. I just wish there were more of you in Tulsa. Cheers, Aaron Thu Oct 30 13:49:27 -0800 2003 664569 0 Aaron D 7 664581 Aaron, I totally agree: 100 years is pretty much enough time to get some decent grub organized (and bear in mind in those early days oysters, clams and ales abounded much more so than today). [It does boggle the mind a little that I have lived there 15% of those 100 years, now I consider that!] I have to confess, I've "given up" rather owing to unmitigated disappointment after disappointment. Perhaps (he throws out) people consider being overly fussy about the minutiae of food to be leaning akin to gluttony and a somewhat moral wobblyness in a city/state that's very religious. But the number one food attraction I ever heard anyone boostering in Tulsa is the bread sticks at the Olive Garden. (I rest my case m'Lud). This reminds me of a Jewish guy I knew in New York who rated Chinese restaurants according to the quality of the crackers in the hot & sour soup. This always seemed to me to miss a pretty essential point about any restaurant: it's main-line FOOD, not the accompanying trivia of the bread & crackers. (The pickles at Goldies Patio Grill is another one, although they are fair enough pickles at that. However WHAT of the burgers and Goldies' other entrees??!) As I said it's intangible but definite difference here versus say Arkansas (good food there to be found) and Kansas (very strong Mexican, BBQ and fried chicken). I want Oklahoma to be a contender in these stakes but I don't see much change. Having said that, places like india Palace have broadened the palate of locals (when it first opened you'd find Indians & British people and a few well-travelled souls there, but now it's a local hangout for people who've discovered that flavorful, even spicy and attractive food is a nice change of pace). Similarly a few Japanese places are flourishing, as is the oriental market at 21st & GArnett which I knew when it was 1/4 its current size and the only place (I think) you can get live crabs and goodies like that in Tulsa still today. But by and large I cook at home and go out when elsewhere. (See my most recent post [URL below] if interested.) It struck me you could more or less not go far wrong stumbling into any place on the near S side of Omaha. Old school Italian joints, Bohemian Cafe and neighborhood bars. I was surprised to hear you mention Ron's Chilli ~ its ghastly milky white concoction is not my idea of a hearty bowl of red. Ike's maybe a little more like it but nowhere do they simply put meat onions and ground peppers and salt together and let the magic happen. Anyway, let us know if you do find any (black?) golden nuggets. Link: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/show/122172#664522 Thu Oct 30 14:58:54 -0800 2003 664570 0 Mike 8 665324 As a transplanted Tulsan, I must admit to be surprised at the comments bemoaning the lack of good food in Tulsa. Granted, I only get back once a year but I always eat well when I do return. The must eat on my list is Nelsons Buffeteria in downtown. The best chicken fried steak I have ever eaten. Claude's on Peoria has superthin and delicious hamburgers. Superthin seems to be a Tulsa thing (e.g. Ron's, Brownies). And of course Jamil's (you know it must be good from the autographed Tommy Lasorda circa 1975 picture on the wall.) Bodeans and White River both serve good seafood. And Full Moon Cafe has great tortilla soup if you like it creamy plus the Sheridan location has a great view of Tulsa. Sat Dec 20 22:31:27 -0800 2003 664581 0 Steve 1 664654 Please see http://www.chowhound.com/midwest/boards/midwest/messages/12983.html Mon Nov 03 17:21:27 -0800 2003 664459 0 Mike