121906 Mon Aug 25 21:38:48 -0700 2003 29 8 General Midwest Archive 0 663242 I'm visiting KC this weekend and previously made an inquiry on this board re chowing down. Thanks to those who responded. Absent from my query was the topic of breakfast. What are the top breakfast spots in town? Dives are acceptable if not preferred (the sign of a true Hound!!). Please, no places serving scones or frittatas. Thanks again. Mon Aug 25 21:38:48 -0700 2003 0 Ira 1 663243 Hey, Ira! Getting those last minute details done, huh? When do you arrive and when do you leave? I'll warn ya! You aren't gonna have near enough time to eat your way across Kansas City! For breakfast dives, ya just can't beat Cascone's Grill in City Market. They've been around forever (like around 1939 or thereabouts)! Big crowds so go early-early-early or take your time people-watching while you wait for a table. Not a place to casually linger. They'll give ya the bum's rush when you finish eating to get that table turned. Saturday is a big big day at City Market and it's a real tradition to go to Cascone's before shopping with all the farmers who haul in their produce, pies, cookies, breads, jellies and jams, fresh flowers, live chickens and ducks, you name it! This whole scene is a slice of Americana you won't want to miss. Cascone's has been located on the City Market square since the early 1970s, but this summer they moved across the street to their original home (4th St. around Walnut). Another terrific breakfast dive across from City Market is The Diner (3rd & Grand). It's in an old gas station. Real earthy! Good food and lots of it. You'll feel like you walked into a 1950s time machine. Not exactly sure of the hours, but wouldn't be surprised if both Cascone's and The Diner are closed on Sunday. I may be wrong. Not sure about holiday Monday. Off the beaten path but still wildly popular is Dagwood's (on SW Blvd, several blocks west of Rainbow). Fabulous biscuits and gravy! Biscuits are piping hot and flaky (and if they aren't, just send 'em back -- I've only ever had to do that once). Dagwood's has been around forever and a former waitress there, Ruby, has owned it for many years. I can't begin to tell you how many floods it's weather. The day the water backs off, all the regulars are there sweeping it out and cleaning it to the core and putting it operational again within a few days. Amazing spunky joint! Fric & Frac on 39th Street at Genessee (two blocks east of State Line) has a big old Sunday breakfast but they don't open until 11 a.m. (or a bit after). It's a loveable neighborhood joint bar and grill. Get there early and wait for doors to open. Grab a seat by the window so you can see all comers and goers. I promise you, you'll see everything there from blue-haired ladies to Rings & Things Part I & II (the neighborhood tattoo and piercing crowd), bikers to Benz-drivers, suits to skimpies. They open at 11 a.m. on Saturday too, but no breakfast menu then. Saturday's feast is 3 tacos/$1.30 (or so). Okay, so they're not world class tacos but the ambiance makes up for it. Order "a six-pack of tacos and a Boulevard Pale Ale" and they'll think you've been there before. Worth the price of admission just for the people-watchin'. Six bucks and a few coins covers the tacos, the beer and the tip. The Mexican neighborhood around SW Blvd and Summit has several restaurants that do Sunday morning Mexican spreads, complete with menudo if you need it after a raucous Saturday night. It'll fix you right up. Peach Tree Buffet (Eastwood Trfwy & I-435 or 18th & Paseo) have good soul food brunches on the weekend and a brunch-time piano player on Sunday (at least at the Eastwood spot). Pay when you arrive and roll outta there when you can't eat one more bite. They've got a website with hours. Three Friends (24th & Prospect) is a Thursday through Sunday barbecue/soul food joint. Good Sunday feast! Personally, my opinion is that The Corner (Westport Rd & Broadway) hasn't been worth anything for the past many years. Two new owners past its prime and charismatic days. I also have little use for Chubby's and Sydney's (both on Broadway, about a block or so apart). Jimmy's (on Troost) bores me to tears. On a good day, Sharp's in Brookside (63rd, two blocks east of Wornall Rd) is about three-fourths what The Corner was in its hayday. Service is generally kind of iffy there, and sometimes the food is a bit more than decent. It would be down kind of low on my list of recommendations. Lots of folks love Bell St. Mama's (39th & Bell, one block east of State Line). I'm so-so on the place mostly because the owner told me everything was homemade right there. Found out otherwise when a waitress innocently informed me that they didn't get their delivery of commercial cole slaw one day when I wondered why I wasn't served a side of slaw with my sandwich. Then she told me several other things that aren't made in-house. I don't have to have everything homemade, but don't lie to me about it. Turns me off a joint pronto. Just for another completely different option, Bo Ling's in the Board of Trade Building (south of the Plaza, off Main Street, kitty corner from a huge construction project) has fabu dim sum brunches Saturday and Sunday. And for a bit of additional Saturday entertainment, you might call and see if either The Roasterie (coffee roaster) and/or Boulevard Brewery are having their tastings and tours this coming Saturday. Late morning at The Roasterie, early afternoon at the brewery. You need reservations for either one and they may not do them on a holiday weekend. They're very close to each other and both just a few blocks off SW Blvd and Summit. Both have websites that may give more info. Hey, Dave Feldman - mention any of these to Maria next time you see her and watch her glow! I first met her eons ago when she waited tables at The Corner when it was absolutely, positively THE place to be on Saturday and Sunday morning. Man, it was a great place back then. Pity it has deteriorated so much. Mon Aug 25 22:53:34 -0700 2003 663242 0 Jane 2 663245 Jane--you are the definitive KC Hound. Can't thank you enough for all of your input. You really will enhance our first trip to KC. We are arriving Fri afternoon and heading back to LA on Monday afternoon. With only 72 hours at our disposal, it looks like we'll barely scratch the surface of KC's gastronomical landscape. If you or a friend or family member ever heads out to SoCal, please ask me for restaurant referrals. I would love to reciprocate. Thanks again. Tue Aug 26 01:49:07 -0700 2003 663243 0 Ira 3 663269 Thanks for the offer for SoCal recommendations, Ira. Doubt if I'll be coming that way but daughter hauls to horse shows in California at least a few times a year. She's usually in NoCal or Sacramento, but sometimes she does get down to the LA area. I wish you all the best for your 72-hour sojourn to our fair city, and it sounds like we might just have some much-needed relief from this hideous heat and humidity for the holiday weekend. It's been just ghastly here! You do have a good prescription for cholesterol drugs filled for your trip here don't you? Your arteries will just never be the same again! LOL Wed Aug 27 03:55:46 -0700 2003 663245 0 Jane 4 663304 Bummer about Lamar's ... Can't wait to get to KC tomorrow. Aside from the great food we'll be eating, there's a lot to see as well. You can thank us for the improved weather. My wife and I have been very lucky in our travels. It seems that wherever we go, the good weather follows. Hope I'm not jinxing us. When we travel, I always use this board to get info. I must say your posts have been the most comprehensive, well written posts I've ever received. I'm sure they will be accurate as well. Thanks so much. I will report back next week with an overview of our dining experience. Thu Aug 28 23:24:31 -0700 2003 663269 0 Ira 5 663314 >> It seems that wherever we go, the good weather follows. Can we call upon you come mid-winter and again in summer every year? :) >> I'm sure they will be accurate as well. Oh! ::gulp:: You're holding me responsible for accuracy here??? LOL The biggest fear with sticking one's neck out to make a recommendation is that someone will actually make their choices based on the information given. And then have a horrible experience! Yipes! Seriously though, there's just no accounting for personal taste and sensibilities. And there's also no way to predict if a named restaurant might suddenly hit the skids or have an off day. It happens. Sometimes the skids are temporary, as in a day when several staff members call in sick leaving the joint in the lurch and having a dramatic impact on service and quality. Sometimes it's because a new owner has taken over and simply ruined the hard efforts of the previous owner while continuing to reap the praises of people who once loved the joint but haven't dined there since the new owners took over (e.g. The Corner, Georgia's Greek Restaurant, and others). Well, at this time, Ira & Wife are on their way with list in hand. Sure hope they enjoy their time (and meals) in Kansas City and I'm certainly thankful they came to save us from the drought and hellish heat. Maybe next time they visit, Ira will ask for other recommendations so we get a chance to brag about places like Jasper's and Il Trullo (Italian), Thai Place and Thai 2000, Hung Vuong (Vietnamese), La Bodega (tapas and mezze), The Phoenix and Jardine's (jazz joints), Cafe Sebastienne at the Contemporary Art Gallery and the Nelson-Atkins Museum of Arts' cafe, The Grille on Broadway, Browne's Market & Deli, and . . . Fri Aug 29 15:59:46 -0700 2003 663304 0 Jane 2 663254 Jane! What a great rundown. We try to believe that Sharp's is close to what The Corner was 10-15 years ago but it doesn't work for us either. All the toddlers have grown up & Steve is sadly gone. Thanks for doing all the hard work replying accurately on behalf of the KC 'hounds. Tue Aug 26 15:53:46 -0700 2003 663243 0 BChow 2 663266 Heck, it put a smile on MY face and I'm never even up for breakfast. Well, come to think of it, I did force myself to drag my rear over to Maxine's Fine Food a few times. Wed Aug 27 03:27:26 -0700 2003 663243 0 Dave Feldman 3 663268 Hey, Dave! I really need to call Maxine's son one of these days and see how she's doing. Ill health has forced her to close the restaurant a few times in the last several years, but she's always coaxed back when she feels strong enough. Last I heard, though, she's closed for good. Can't imagine where the Chiefs have their team breakfasts now. They always got such a magnificent carb load and lots of hugs from their girl Maxine. You know, I think it took a lot out of Maxine when the city was working to resurrecting the 18th and Vine district and pouring all that money into the effort but shunted aside long-time restaurateurs like Maxine, Ruby and Papa Lew when city leaders went a'courtin' an upscale NYC-based chain soul food restaurant. It was a real slap in the face to those industrious locals, it was. Considering the TIF money they planned to throw at the out-of-towners, they could have given the locals some concessions and we could have had a lot of unity and spirit for that area. I'm glad Peach Tree Buffet eventually got in down there, but it would have been nice if some of those joints that were there for years were given the same kind of assistance to return to the rehabbed building. Wed Aug 27 03:49:12 -0700 2003 663266 0 Jane 4 663279 First Lamar's and now Maxine's?! Two treasures. Thu Aug 28 01:32:06 -0700 2003 663268 0 Dave Feldman 1 663247 Great suggestions from Jane, especially Cascones in the River Market. The only place I would add to the list is the Corner Cafe in Riverside (4541 NW Gateway, not to be confused with The Corner in Westport). Not really a dive, but very "Kansas City". Lots of locals who have been going there for years, great food, loooong waits on weekend mornings. And when you get done there, you can go browse the liquor selection at Red-X and get yourself some lottery tickets! Other than that I still like breakfast at Chubby's at about 37th and Broadway after a really late night (open 24 hours). I think the quality of the food has gone up since they moved from across the street. I rarely hit the real dives anymore, ever since the grandaddy of them all, Sanderson's, closed down several years ago. I miss that place like I'd miss a family member, lol. Have a great time here in KC! Jerry Tue Aug 26 09:55:33 -0700 2003 663242 0 Zeemanb 2 663262 if you like chubbys, just don't hang around the restrooms much because you will soon learn the cooks use the toilet but they don't wash hands before going back to work the bathrooms are so filthy it probably wouldn't make much difference anyhow Tue Aug 26 22:30:40 -0700 2003 663247 0 maeve 3 663272 Come to think of it, there's a good place across from the Chubby's on Broadway and down the street a bit--Sydney's. It's more of a late-night breakfast place. But the food and the staff are both good (friendly midtown locals), to say nothing of the freak watching after 2am. A good mishmash of the late-night midtown crowd. Occasionally they throw in an interesting special. Last October featured pumpkin pancakes. Mmmm. Wed Aug 27 10:35:06 -0700 2003 663262 0 m.toast 4 663277 when chubbys built their new building sydneys moved into the spot chubbys vacated after many years of residency at 2 or 3 in the morning most of sydneys customers still think they are walking into chubbys sydneys hires the rejects from chubbys Wed Aug 27 20:45:52 -0700 2003 663272 0 maeve 2 663264 Jerry - I really loved Corner Cafe in Riverside when it was in the older building right by where they are now. It was more intimate and felt more like a loveable joint to me. The new building seats so many more people and just sort of feels "corporate" to me. The staff attitude changed with the move, probably because they had to hire so many more people and you just can't always find those wonderful cotton-candy-haired, hash-slinging waitresses easily. It is very popular, however. I have to say, though, that they left me with a less-than-happy attitude toward them in general a few years ago. I was going to a friend's in Weston for a pick-it-up-on-your-way potluck dinner. I called Corner Cafe in advance to see if I could order 14 individual slices of pie, either each in an individual styrofoam pie slice box or just placed a few together in each of a couple large take-home boxes. The owner was most accomodating and said they could easily do that. I assured him I'd call in advance with the order so they could package them at their own convenience and not on short notice when I came by to pick them up. I also asked if they took personal checks. "No problem," the owner said, "as long as it's drawn on a local bank." So I called everyone attending the potluck to ask their favorite pie flavor and then called Corner Cafe to place the order at about 11 a.m. on a weekday to be picked up at 5 p.m. that afternoon. They assured me the pie slices would be ready and waiting for me. I arrived at 5 p.m. and not a single slice had been cut yet. They seemed terribly annoyed with me and even the owner (who I'd made arrangements with and who was so gracious on the phone) was testy with me. He assigned a bus boy to prepare my pie slices and it was obvious that the kid had never cut pie before. And he hated doing it so moved at a snail's pace, grimacing the entire time. Took him until about 5:40 to have them all jam-packed and crumbled into boxes (from where I was waiting, I could see him working in that center island service station). When I paid, I wrote out my check and handed it to the owner. He looked at it and harumphed, "I can't take this! It's not a local bank!" Well, excuuuuuse me, it was drawn on Commerce Bank (one of the larger banks covering the entire metro area) and had my bank branch's address on it, 43rd & State Line, Kansas City, Kansas. He had the audacity to say that if the bank was at 43rd and State Line but on the Missouri side, he'd accept it. I took my check back, and even though I had just enough cash in my pocket to pay for the pie slices, I walked out the door. I wasn't going to give him the satisfaction of bullying me and treating me rudely like that. Haven't been back since and, just on general principle, I don't recommend the place. The next time this group had a potluck dinner, I ordered magnificent pies from Golden Boy in Merriam. They were just divine and I got a wide variety of fillings. Everyone was delighted. Wed Aug 27 02:28:15 -0700 2003 663247 0 Jane 3 663273 Wow, that's really too bad, I would have been pretty irate for sure! Can't say I've really had any bad experiences there, but my only memories of the place have been from the past few years since they have been in the new building. Also, my dad and his buddies from the gas company are in there all the time, so when I go with he and my mom he usually always knows whomever is waiting on us. I'll heed your warning and be sure to take dad along if I'm ever going to take out of town guests there, lol! Pretty sad if that's one of the only reasons we always get good service there though! Also, I've gotten a kick out of seeing the old time 'rasssler "Handsome Harley Race" there on a couple of occasions. He's Riverside Royalty for sure! Jerry Wed Aug 27 13:05:16 -0700 2003 663264 0 Zeemanb 3 663274 Wow, that's really too bad, I would have been pretty irate for sure! Can't say I've really had any bad experiences there, but my only memories of the place have been from the past few years since they have been in the new building. Also, my dad and his buddies from the gas company are in there all the time, so when I go with he and my mom he usually always knows whomever is waiting on us. I'll heed your warning and be sure to take dad along if I'm ever going to take out of town guests there, lol! Pretty sad if that's one of the only reasons we always get good service there though! Also, I've gotten a kick out of seeing the old time 'rasssler "Handsome Harley Race" there on a couple of occasions. He's Riverside Royalty for sure! Jerry Wed Aug 27 13:05:26 -0700 2003 663264 0 Zeemanb 1 663248 Mmmm. Cascone's. It's been too long. Their lunchtime beef and noodles are simply scrumptious. Don't forget Georgie Porgie's at 81st and Wornall. Best pancakes in town. If you try this one, best get there early. There's usually a line and you have to get your name on the list. A great place for good greasy eggs, but not so great if you're in a hurry. The pace is leisurely. It's breakfast-only on weekends, and the place is stuffed full of toys and retro memorabilia. If you're very brave and going for the hole in the wall factor, try Nichols Lunch at 39th and SW Trafficway. Last time I was there I ordered eggs and hash browns at 3am, and was offered a hit of crack as a bonus. Eek. Tue Aug 26 11:48:38 -0700 2003 663242 0 m.toast 2 663265 I'm glad m.toast recommended Georgie Porgie's at 81st and Wornall. It was one of a couple I had in mind and just forgot to add to my previous suggestions. I think my brain was sending me a signal that I might break the board here if I loaded that post with anything more! LOL Yes, Georgie Porgie's is a fun place to go -- very funky and nice people. Good food, too, for such a tiny hole in the wall joint. I am not enthusiastic about Nichol's Lunch. Haven't had any meal there in probably 10 years that was even worth wasting my time and money. And, in general, the staff is just lousy. I can handle funky staff with 'tude; in fact, in some places like Fric & Frac, I love the staff's 'tude. But at Nichol's, the attitude is more like I-hate-you-I-hate-my-job-I-hate-my-boss-I-hate-everything-and-I-don't-want-to-be-here-Here's-your-food-and-your-check-and-don't-you-dare-bother-me-or-ask-me-for-a-refill-on-anything. Sometimes I still go there, however, with musician friends who don't want to hang out at late night bars after their gigs. They eat and complain bitterly about the quality of the food and service. I just order a Coke and enjoy the company of friends, and try to tune out Nichol's staff. For middle of the night chow, I much prefer to go over to Town Topic at Broadway and SW Trafficway. They're open 24/7. If they're hoppin', they kind of discourage lingering, but most of the time it's not much of a problem. Peak middle-of-the-night time for them is when the bars close at 3 a.m. Wed Aug 27 02:47:50 -0700 2003 663248 0 Jane 1 663267 Wanted to mention a couple of more ideas, Ira, just to totally and completely overwhelm you! LOL Ranch Cafe (I-475, east on 87th Street, right at the Hillcrest Road stoplight, maybe 90 yards to Benjamin Ranch, then up the hill onto the ranch property) is a dumpy old building that 75 years ago was built as the chuckhouse for the ranch hands. Eventually it was turned into a cafe open to the public. The Reynolds have owned it for about 14 years now; the wife was a waitress there for the previous owner. Most of the tiny staff is family and they're "real good, salt of the earth folks." They open at 6 a.m. Tuesday through Saturday and 8 a.m. on Sunday, and close at 2 p.m. each day (closed up tight on Monday). Hearty good breakfasts -- good biscuits and gravy, hash browns and cottage, omlets, and steak and egg combos. I often get bacon and egg with three little pancakes for $2.25, and I'm always impressed how fresh the eggs taste and how they fry my bacon to the exact crispiness I order. And the bottomless coffee cups are filled so promptly it will make your head spin. The waitresses have always been just as sweet as they could be and always make folks feel so welcome there. Terrific filling-but-cheap lunches there, too (hand-pounded massive pork tenderloins, chicken fried steak, meatloaf, good home cookin'), and amazing blackberry cobbler a couple days a week! Ranch Cafe is really a gritty place! You fully expect ranch hands to walk in any minutes -- and sometimes they do! Interesting memorabilia from the ranch is all over the place. Benjamin Ranch is kind of an historic place in this community and it's just fun to go eat there and support nice folks like the Reynolds. Also, I don't think anyone has mentioned Lamar's Donuts, have they? Heck, you can go to Lamar's and gulp down a coupla hot-from-the-fryer glazed donuts and then go have breakfast somewhere else! LOL Lamar's donuts are just superb! But don't even think about messing with the franchise operations around town; they don't begin to measure up. Go to THE SOURCE, the orignal Lamar's Donuts, in the little old converted gas station on Linwood, between Broadway and Gilham Road. Blink and you'll miss it -- north side of street, across from and past Costco a bit. Old Ray Lamar is still going in every day, in his ninth (or is it tenth, now?) decade of life. He's cranked out enough donuts and worked enough years at it that he was even on Jay Leno a few years back. I love their glazed donuts, especially if they are still warm, but their cake donuts never disappoint me. And if I'm feeling really decadent, I pop for a German Chocolate Bismarck. Superb! Wed Aug 27 03:37:19 -0700 2003 663242 0 Jane 2 663270 Oh, darn! The 5 a.m. news just reported that Lamar's Donuts original location (the one I just wrote about here a few hours ago) is history. Ray and his wife Shannon say their health is preventing them from continuing to operate the world famous donut shop. The news kind of sent a mixed message because first they said, "Lamar's _is_ closing," but they never gave a closing date and the video images showed a closed sign in the window. Of course, that footage may have been shot yesterday afternoon after Lamar's closed at 2 p.m. So I am unsure if it is now closed or will close in the future. I'll try to track down the story. One ray of hope, however, is that Ray's stepsons are looking to get a loan to buy the shop from Ray and Shannon, and they plan to operate it themselves. I can only hope it happens and that they continue Ray's traditions. You'll just never find me stepping foot in the Lamar's franchises. I've tried them a few times and they are vastly inferior. I'd rather go to Krispy Kreme than the Lamar's franchises. The franchises are handled by an operation in Nebraska that bought the rights from Ray and Shannon Lamar. Wed Aug 27 06:55:29 -0700 2003 663267 0 Jane 3 663278 I've never been to a Lamar's franchise in KC, but have in Las Vegas (where they are highly inconsistent). But this is sad, horrible, tragic news. Lamars is the place I look most forward to visiting when I hit KC. Agggh! Thu Aug 28 01:30:00 -0700 2003 663270 0 Dave Feldman 4 663281 Dave - I wasn't able to get by Lamar's on Wednesday to see for myself but will sometime this week. Yes, it is very sad. Some of my fondest memories of Lamar's original shop are all the times in the good old days that I accompanied Larry "Fats" Goldberg on his two "eat days" each week. He'd always start out at Lamar's with maybe three glazed donuts. Then we'd proceed to The Corner (before it began deteriorating) where he liked to sit on a little waiting bench near the kitchen and scarf down a stack of buttermilk pancakes. Then a short walk over to Murray's Ice Cream for a double scoop cone before heading to d'Bronx for a slice or two of pizza and then to Fric & Frac for a burger. After that, he was ready for lunch -- maybe a burger, fries and malt at Town Topic or Winstead's. :) He tried some of the local Lamar's franchise shops out of professional curiosity, but was completely unimpressed by them. Of course, all the Lamar's franchises here are out in the 'burbs, and as Goldberg used to say, "I get nosebleeds when I have to leave Midtown!" Man, I miss Fats. Thu Aug 28 03:54:35 -0700 2003 663278 0 Jane 5 663307 I think you might know that my first trip to Kansas City was a Calvin-Trillin tour. My friends and I agreed we would eat only at restaurants that were mentioned in American Fried or Alice Let's Eat (the latter had just come out). I then had the thrill of meeting Mr. T at Russ and Daughters in NYC just before we left. I asked him if there was any place he'd recommend that wasn't in the books. He asked me what I had for him! I told him about Ledo's in Takoma Park, MD (a favorite of Joe H's), which serves terrific pizza on and in the shape of rectangular cafeteria trays. He then told me about RC's (RIP), for which I was grateful. If you remember, there is only a glancing mention of Lamar's in American Fried (and that was in reference to Fats stopping there for doughnuts). It was at Russ & Daughters that I learned that Trillin had (at least at that point) never been to Lamar's, and had never eaten a single Lamar's doughnut. Fri Aug 29 00:44:59 -0700 2003 663281 0 Dave Feldman 6 663308 Dave - RC's? As in out on 135th west of Holmes and across from Jess & Jim's Steakhouse? If so, that's still going (and owned by the same family that owns Jess & Jim's the whole time). If not that RC's, please enlighten me. So Bud Trillin said he'd not been to Lamar's, huh? Gosh, on one hand, I find that hard to beleive, but then again, Trillin was "all growed and gone" from this hometown of his by the time Lamar's started its move into "treasurehood." But gosh, I could have sworn Fats had told me about going to Lamar's with his pal when Trillin was in town visiting family and friends. I know the two of them did some good eatin' together both here and in NYC. Ironic you mention that chapter on Fats in American Fried. I was chatting with another eBay seller one day and she was lamenting how every diet she tried was unworkable for her. I was telling her about Fats Goldberg's "Controlled Cheating" book (as Fats always said, "No, it's NOT a marriage manual!). We had a good chat and I was telling her about crazy Fats. She said the name sounded vaguely familiar. A few days later, she asked me for my mailing address because she wanted to send me something. It arrived on Wednesday -- the Trillin's Tummy Trilogy, including American Fried. Of course, I sat right down and read that chapter about Fats -- and it made me feel almost like I was sitting next to him again. The gal who sent it sells books on eBay and she'd just picked up that book at a garage sale recently. She thought I might enjoy it. Oh, I do -- especially since I lost my copy of the Tummy Trilogy in a flood a few years back and hadn't replaced it. I'm trying desperately to downsize so replacing some of my favorite lost books has been kind of low on my list lately. Fri Aug 29 04:37:59 -0700 2003 663307 0 Jane 7 663320 My last post shows how sick I am. I think I asked about RC's on Chowhound and folks were claiming it had gone downhill. In my mind, it was dead to me! My Trillin trip was in 1979, I believe. At that time, he CT said he had never eaten a doughnut there. I spent quite a bit of time with Fats at his Second Ave. location. I enjoyed his KC tales and a couple of times, split a SMOG pizza (no crust!) with him. Sat Aug 30 02:21:20 -0700 2003 663308 0 Dave Feldman 8 663321 Oh, if your chat with Trillin about Lamar's was in 1979, then I can believed he'd not been there. Goldberg didn't move back to Kansas City until the late 1980s. I bet the two of them hit Lamar's together after than when Trillin came to town. When I lived out on Long Island in the early 1970s, we'd sometimes go to Goldberg's Pizza when we were in the city. At first, we didn't know he was a Kansas City native, but when we found out, we chatted about KC a couple of times, but wasn't anything that would be memorable. I really got to know him well when he was the host at the funky Cafe Lulu on 39th Street around 1990 until it closed in 1992. Sorry Goldberg couldn't get the backing to properly open his pizzeria here in his hometown. He did open one, maybe around 1995 or so. But it was seriously undercapitalized and out in the 'burbs. For a man who really felt very uncomfortable even going to the 'burbs, that was such an odd thing, especially when there were so many suitable Midtown locations available. He was definitely a Midtown bon vivant and so well known here in the urban entertainment area. He also had at his disposal a lot of staff willing and happy to work for him in Midtown, but they weren't about to schlep to the 'burbs every day. He had to keep his regular job after the pizzeria opened. I went a few times, but I went for Goldberg as much as for the pizza. When he wasn't there, it just wasn't the same experience. And the pizza just never measured up to the NYC days and the front-of-house staff was pretty much high school kids who just "didn't get" the whole Goldberg Pizzeria scene. They were more interested in horsing around with pals rather than servicing the diners. Sad. It was very sad when the place closed -- but also rather merciful. It was, however, a huge blow to Goldberg. Even in the late 1990s, however, he was still talking to me about how he could raise the money to open in Midtown. Wasn't long after that, however, that he realized his health would probably prohibit him from ever having his own place again. Sat Aug 30 02:50:05 -0700 2003 663320 0 Jane 5 664957 What makes a restaurant worth going to regularly is not just about the food, but more about the people who run the place and how welcome they make you feel. One of my favorite places was Goldberg's Pizza in Prairie Village, KS (open in the mid-90's). Unlike the original Goldberg's Pizza places in New York, it didn't last long, probably because of its location in a bland suburb of KC, MO. Like a lot of the regular customers, I liked to go there because I enjoyed spending time with Larry "Fats" Goldberg, who filled his pizza joint with his warm, friendly personality. People just had fun around him and he always had interesting things to say. He was also a good listener. He helped me to escape a blue funk of depression following a divorce, and did a lot to restore my sense of humor. What a kind, good and generous man he was, not to mention darn cute. Some women used to go there just to flirt with Larry, who was a popular bachelor in a nice way, not what he would call a Don Juan. I am originally from New York, and he'd lived there for years, so we had a similar perspective on some things, like enjoying having friends from diverse backgrounds. One funny thing was that our nicknames were opposite, because I'd been very thin when I was young (and called Twiggy) while he was overweight when young (and called Fats). We'd both graduated from Southwest High School, but years apart. If we'd been in the same class, we would have looked strange standing next to each other in a photo in the yearbook, because in our (different) senior years, I weighed 90 pounds and he weighed 265 pounds. Instead, we became friends as adults, chatting in the restaurant. It was a shame that Goldberg's Pizza in PV didn't take off as he had hoped, but restaurants are one of the most risky businesses around. The pizza was good, basically a healthy Chicago style. But he could have been serving warm, damp cardboard covered with cheap ketchup and I might still have hung around. That may say as much about my mother's awful cooking as about Larry's smile that lit up the room. Some of the best restaurants are run by people who truly use food as a way to share their caring for other people. His place was like that. His life didn't really revolve around food; it revolved around people. Perhaps one reason Goldberg's Pizza failed was because in the Prairie Village/Mission Hills, KS area, some people don't believe that grownups should have fun. Maturity to them means deadly seriousness and loss of spontaneity. Also, money is seen as the only real mark of success, ignoring the fact that you can't take it with you. Too many folks there choose their friends because of comparable financial situations rather than for their personalities alone. Larry was a successful guy because he liked people for themselves. He would smile and greet folks he met, even when just passing on the street, and he really paid attention and looked them in the eyes. At his pizza joint, he encouraged his guests to enjoy themselves, displayed children's artwork on the walls and and made it a place where people could feel free to be happy with good food and good company. In return, some snotty people made sniping comments about his free-spirited style, sometimes within his hearing. He didn't feel nearly as welcome as he made others. At one point, Larry put up a sign in Goldberg's Pizza reading: "Wife Wanted", which neighborhood gossips called a cheap publicity stunt for the restaurant. The sign attracted a number of applicants for the position and a reporter came to interview Larry about the Wife Wanted Campaign. I didn't read the article; I just witnessed the interview one afternoon when a reporter and photographer visited Larry. He dated several women as a result of posting the sign, but none of them turned out to be Ms. Right. Most of them were nice ladies, but he did have one painful experience with a flaky artist named Erica that depressed him for a while. He took down the sign after that fiasco, upset that his judgment had been off and a nut had slipped under his radar. As a man in his fifties, he'd lived enough to have a good sense of who he could trust and who he couldn't; but we can all be fooled at times and she was pretty enough for him to give her the benefit of the doubt. I had a giant crush on Larry, but I felt like he was way out of my league. I appreciated the company of a kind man and considered him a good friend. My low self-confidence wasn't boosted by overhearing gossip about our "unsuitable" friendship. I was employed as a part-time drugstore clerk and Larry ran a restaurant, so we were apparently not fit company for each other, being on different social levels. None of the successfully employed bachelors in Mission Hills or Prairie Village would have been caught dead chatting with me. This is because as a poor, twice-divorced woman, I am locally considered damaged goods, in some strange way ranking as a trashy tart even though I live like a nun. Most nuns have a more exciting social life than I do. At that low point in my life, I was judging myself by other people's standards, and I sided with the majority viewpoint of myself as worthless, even though I was lucky enough to have a few friends like Larry who liked me for myself. It was a shame that Larry didn't find his match when he put up the "Wife Wanted" sign. I somehow believed that the sign didn't really apply to me, as though in small print someone had printed the words: "Except Twiggy", and I was not really meant to walk up to the counter and say: "I've come for the job." Still, even though Larry "Fats" Goldberg didn't find a wife, he seemed fairly happy as a bachelor with a close circle of good friends and many fond acquaintances. After the pizza joint closed, he became a host at another restaurant and always did his best to make people feel welcome there. When he died of Alzheimer's disease early this year, Larry left a lot of friends with good memories of him. It wouldn't be hard to recreate his pizza recipes, but he was one of a kind. I'm sorry that he probably didn't know how much I thought of him. The last time I saw Larry, years ago, he didn't seem to recognize me, and I thought I'd said goodbye a long time ago. But when I heard that he had finally passed away, after a long illness, a lot of memories came flooding back, and I cried. When a married man dies, his widow mourns him. When a bachelor dies, who knows how many women shed tears for him? In Larry's case, probably quite a few, with me being perhaps only one of hundreds. As a mere customer in his restaurant, some might ask, who could I possibly have been to him? To some folks, he gave me food and I gave him money, nothing more; but because sharing food is a social activity, it's never strictly business. I've been sad about Larry's death for months, but I don't want to stay there. I'd rather remember the good times, and be thankful that at least I did get the chance to know him when he was well, happy, hopeful and cute. Twiggy Wed Nov 19 00:25:00 -0800 2003 663281 0 Twiggy 1 663416 I'm a little late to the table with this reply but I thought I'd give you my two bits' worth just because I feel like opining. At length. For which I apologize if you had other plans for today. First, it's a dirty, stinking, rotten, fetid, purrulent shame that Ray Lamar's place on Linwood is going fallow. As an expatriate Bostonian I used to pine for Dunkin' Donuts and would just as soon eat raw bacon as to set foot in a Krispy Kreme, but Lamar's proved there was life beyond the donut with a handle. The Lamar's franchise operations are just Krispy Kreme wannabes, and since I've already established that K.K. outlets are anathema, it's hardly high praise for the bastard children of Ray Lamar. John's Space Age Donuts in Overland Park are pretty darned decent, and I give high marks for its corporate monicker, but Ray, thanks for the years of greatness, and may you enjoy many fine years of sleeping in late. But I digress. Good places for breakfast? As long as I'm waxing nostalgic, I'll put in a vote for a place that hasn't been here for some years now. The Original Pancake House was just plain cool, if for nothing else than the menu. It was informative, it was retro without being kitsch, it was B I G, and the overall vibe of the place did not say strip mall. OK, the service could really stink at times, but overall I have god memories of the place. I give high marks to any place that believes so strongly in its product that it really doesn't seem to care that we may not want to read about the enzymes in its pancake batter. About a year and a half ago my wife and I had breakfast at another O.H.P. in Bethesda, Maryland, and doggoned if it wasn't just as good as I remembered it. Continuing the rant: Sorry but First Watch and Le Peep just don't rate. They're both too dandified, despite the niceness of the food. As for IHOP and Perkins, well woop-di-doo, you can go anywhere in the country and savor the creations of underachieving chefs. Village Inn's pretty good, Country Kitchen's adequate, but if you want to go local in Kansas City, you cannot go wrong at Waid's. I'm usually suspect of any place that's alarmingly popular with folks age 75-dead (I likely wont eat at Yarborough's until my teeth fall out). But Waid's just fits the bill for non-greasy-spoon, tasty and unpretentious breakfast fare...decent food, a kewl retro menu (you'll notice I give high marks to retro, call me madcap but it's just a quirk I have), and they don't have conniptions when I ask for room-temperature pancake syrup (another quirk of mine, having been raised a yankee). Lastly, though Waid's is a chain, it's a local chain, so you're dining at a place unique to the area. I haven't been to the Woodswether Cafe which I hear is pretty good; nor have I been to Winstead's for breakfast but I'll wager it's pretty decent as well. That said, a malted waffle, two basted eggs and a slice of ham at Waid's is still it for me, at least until my first quadruple bypass. Fri Sep 05 00:42:55 -0700 2003 663242 0 Andy 2 663429 Yes, breakfast at Waid's is excellent - at least at the location in Prairie Village. Great biscuits and gravy, too, and chicken fried steak. My mother and her 70ish cronies used to go there and the staff was so wonderful to them. Separate checks for everyone, little pots of water for their Sanka, dry toast, very crisp bacon. They were treated so nicely. Also Waid's used to have the best chocolate and lemon icebox pies. It was great when Mom would pick one up and bring it home. Yum! D. Fri Sep 05 12:17:53 -0700 2003 663416 0 Donna - MI