114311 Mon Nov 24 11:54:14 -0800 2003 17 7 Chicago Area 0 622008 Sorry if this is the dumb question of the year, but.... I recently noticed some mortar/pestle sets at the Harvest Time produce store on Lawrence near Rockwell. Does anyone know what they are made of? Are these lava rock sets? I want to get a lava rock mortar/pestle, but have never seen one. Thanks. Mon Nov 24 11:54:14 -0800 2003 0 Kenny from Rogers Park 1 622012 Aloha! I have seen in the Sur La Table catalog lava rock mortar/pestle sets, I think they were about $45.00 or so. I would order one but the shipping to HI would be too high. Maybe they wtill have them. Mon Nov 24 12:38:47 -0800 2003 622008 0 the basnbull 1 622016 I bought a lava mortar and pestle many moons ago at a Mexican grocery store. It ain't fancy, and it was real cheap, but this prehistoric "food processor" has served me well for over 20 years. You might look for one at Aquascalientes or other hispanic grocery stores. Mon Nov 24 13:07:37 -0800 2003 622008 0 David Hammond 1 622022 AKA-a "molcajete" don't buy from Sur La Table or the like find them cheap at Mexican markets sidenote-molcajetes are at the center of a sanitation debate Judy Rogers writes in Zuni Cafe Cookbook that they used to serve a famous guacomole in individual molcajetes, but the SF Health and Sanitation Dept. made them stop. Mon Nov 24 14:39:20 -0800 2003 622008 0 malcarne 2 622023 just because a Health Dept. in a big city cracks down on something (molcajetes, in this instance) doesn't mean the item in question isn't sanitary or safe to use, it just means the Health Dept. got a mandate or heard about a food scare or somebody ruined it for everyone else by being sloppy or dirty or illegal. At one point in both LA and San Diego (where I worked in restaurants for many years in college) they were threatening to ban the use of all wooden cutting boards and any chefs knives that had wooden handles and all wooden spoons . . . because they felt that the wood "harbored potentially deadly bacteria." Yeah, if you never washed them ever, sure, but if you're clean and keep your tools clean it's not an issue. So maybe some jerk in SF was serving skanky salsa in molcajetes or double dipping after they were pulled off the table or something like that. Molcajetes make sublime salsas and sauces that actually still retain texture . . . (rather than blenders which can puree the life ut of some of them, esp. tomatillos) and just like cast iron skillets, many people feel like as they get older and "seasoned" they just get better. I'm almost postive Diana Kennedy has a few pages in her book about their importance in the Mexican kitchen. They have them at La Guadalupana on 26th in Little Village (also known as la Casa de Masa). And don't do what I did and wait until you're in Mexico to buy one because then you have to haul the thing home and volcanic rock isn't light in the luggage. No matter how or where you get it, they are a wonderful addition to a kitchen for different sauces and salsas (makes great, earthy pesto!) bjt Mon Nov 24 15:25:47 -0800 2003 622022 0 bjt 3 622026 So, are all molcajetes necessarily made of lava rock? Mon Nov 24 15:50:15 -0800 2003 622023 0 Kenny from Rogers Park 4 622030 wow, I wish I was home near all my Mexican cookbooks rather than here at my desk acting like I'm working so that I could answer with confidence. . . but here's what I think I know. In Mexcio there are molcajetes and metates, both are made from lava rock but a molcajete is bowl-shaped for grinding chiles, nuts and vegetables for sauces and salsas and a metate is flat and long for grinding out the corn kernels for masa for tortillas and other masa items like tamales and sopes. I haven't seen molcajetes made out of any other material than lava rock . . . but I have seen mortar and pestles from other countries made out of a wide variety of materials such as marble and glass and even wood. I have seen goofy fake molcajetes made out of plastic so that you can serve your salsa in them and they look quasi authetico or rustic but they are purely for condiments in taco joints (or for those unfortuante San Francisco restaurants). an aside, but . . . this rock/mortar concept is so wonderfully universal. Where I grew up in Northern California you sometimes come across smooth small bowl-shaped holes at the top of large, wide rocks and this is where the Mi-Wok Indians would grind the acorns (after triple soaking!) to be made into greul/mush or to make flour for a bread of sorts. Grind away . . . bjt Mon Nov 24 16:29:26 -0800 2003 622026 0 bjt 3 622028 I was just passing along an anecdote vis vis sanitation issues and molcajetes. Everyone has their own standards of sanitation(unfortunately). San Francisco is famous for being overzealous in matters of public health(actually, CA for that matter). I imagine lugging one back from the corner market is MUCH easier than doing so from another country. I've seen molcajetes online for upwards of 60-70 bucks when they're easily had for half that or less at a supermercado. Mon Nov 24 16:16:21 -0800 2003 622023 0 malcarne 4 622031 The anecdote is interesting (and I'm a huge fan of Judi Rodgers and the Zuni Kitchen cookbook) I just didn't want Kenny from RP to think that molcajetes were the "problem" and shy away from purchasing one. There is a debate (and I wonder if she mentions this in the cookbook) on whether you should ever wash your molcajate with soap because (I mentioned this earlier)many people think they should be treated like cast iron skillets and allowed to season over time. I attack mine with a good sturdy scrub brush and lots of hot water . . . never had a problem. bjt Mon Nov 24 16:44:41 -0800 2003 622028 0 bjt 5 622033 The funny thing is: a molcajete's on my Christmas List this year. I've always been intrigued by them and for whatever reason never picked one up at the taqueria down the street. The owner's so cool I'd love to purchase my molcajete from him thereby sending more money his way than my usual taco jones. If Santa doesn't provide then I've finally got my motivation. ( I love the idea of Santa lugging hundreds of molcajetes to gourmands everywhere this holiday). Poor Rudolph :) Mon Nov 24 18:06:39 -0800 2003 622031 0 malcarne 4 622032 Price isn't the only factor in buying a molcajete. Quality is major. Most molcajetes that I've seen sold in the US are of very poor quality. Common problems include: 1) the molcajete is of a composite material (basically cement) rather than a piece of stone; 2) the surface is too irregular; and 3) the stone used is too soft. Problems 1 & 3 result in lots of grit in your salsa (which, while harmless, doesn't taste good and isn't good for your teeth). Problem 2 makes grinding chiles and tomato skins difficult, while grinding spices is next to impossible. While you can get a good molcajete in Mexico (and some places in the US) much cheaper, you're better off paying an arm and a leg for one at Sur la Table than by buying a $12 totally useless "bargain" at your local tienda. If you only want a molcajete as decoration for your kitchen or as a serving dish, that doesn't matter, though. Scott Mon Nov 24 18:06:10 -0800 2003 622028 0 Scott 5 622063 Scott, Thanks for pointing this out. I bought a molcajete and tejotle at Maxwell Street Market for ten bucks a year or two ago, and it suffers from at least the second and third deficiencies. I would like to buy one from a local market, but I am a bit wary at this point. Has anyone bought one from La Guadulupana? I have also been advised to seek out La Michoacana in Aurora for Mexican cooking tools. Anyone been there? Tue Nov 25 10:09:53 -0800 2003 622032 0 Aaron D 3 622059 I recently went looking for a large mortar/pestle for my mother. After scouring all the mexican markets in rogers park and edgewater, and found many cheaper than sur la table, but they were of pretty bad quality. Best I found and a great value were those on sale at the thai grocery, $29 I think for a 10 cm diameter mortar Tue Nov 25 09:28:56 -0800 2003 622023 0 zim 1 622061 I know a mocajate has distinct advantages for making salsa's and stuff, but as an alternative, what about those Japanese ones. I do not have one, but I have always admired them. Two things appeal to me about the Japanese mortar and pestles. First, they are pointed at the bottom. It seems this would keep your energy focused and keep the stuff from getting all over the place. Like sometimes in a traditional marble mortar, the stuff squirms around. I would think, pointed bottom=no squirm. Second, the Japanese versions are ridged. These ridges may not produce the texture of a mocajate but it probably does produce something good. Also, the ridges should help the crushing/smoothing process. The obvious source for such a mortar and pestle would be our recently discussed Mitsuwa, but I also saw them recently at Chef's Catalogue on Clark. They were having a HUGE sale, but I think it has passed. Rob Tue Nov 25 09:46:35 -0800 2003 622008 0 Vital Information 2 622064 Is Chef's Catalog one of those places that's always having a huge sale? It seems like I've seen ads for the past year for 60% off. Tue Nov 25 10:11:57 -0800 2003 622061 0 Aaron D 3 622127 Indeed, their sales are pretty frequent (sometimes one seems to begin before the last one has ended), and it's usually along the lines of "All left-handed stepstools and solar-powered oven mitts 60% off! [much tinier type:] Rest of store 10% off!" Target often has both a better selection and better prices. Wed Nov 26 10:28:41 -0800 2003 622064 0 Bob S. 1 622071 Folks, the Not About Food board is the place to discuss the general properties of molcajetes. Advice about finding molcajetes in Chicago is on-topic for this board, but much of the discussion here isn't Chicago-centric. The rest of the posters on this site who use the Not About Food board for these sorts of discussion are almost certainly going to miss this thread, which is a shame, because it's chock full of great advice on molcajetes. You also won't get widest possible input on the topic here. Finally, this is disrupting the otherwise focused discussion of Chicago food, except for the places where the discussion has turned to where to find molcajetes locally. We will be deleting the parts of this thread that are not Chicago-centric. We invite participants to repost on the Not About Food board. In future, we'd appreciate help in directing misplaced queries to their appropriate boards before large threads develop. Tue Nov 25 12:15:44 -0800 2003 622008 2 The Chowhound Team 2 622082 I would also like to know about the item at that particualr grocery store in chicago, I've seen them there and have often wondered. please don't delete the whole thread, I hope to see some on-topic responses. Tue Nov 25 17:21:02 -0800 2003 622071 0 SC