111796 Sun Nov 17 14:20:10 -0800 2002 18 7 Chicago Area 0 606017 Last night when we we driving home from the wonderful Thai Aree dinner, I made a point to see if the Buenos Aires Deli still exists. Yes! So, N. Tocus, get your sandwich de migas and other goodies and do report back ASAP! VI Link: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/show/111738#605583 Sun Nov 17 14:20:10 -0800 2002 0 Vital Information 1 606018 Speaking of open, JeffB and I were discussing the Maxwell Street hot dog stand at the intersection of Damen and Diversey a few weeks ago. I thought it was open, Jeff said it wasn’t, he was right, it was not open. I just drove past (Costco run) and it is now open for business. I would have stopped for a dog, but I had just had Julius Meinl coffee and croissant and wanted the flavors to linger as long as possible. Enjoy, Gary Sun Nov 17 14:44:59 -0800 2002 606017 0 G Wiv 2 606022 Good dog in the hood - yea Sun Nov 17 16:11:51 -0800 2002 606018 0 Eat it now 3 606026 I noticed that this had a pork chop sandwich as well as very similar signage to the one Dave Hammond wrote about a few weeks back-- I assume it is an outpost? I'm torn about it because it does look good but as a proper bourgeois Roscoe Villagean I'm not sure I think Damen and Diversey needed more encouragement toward a 24-hour street economy. Sun Nov 17 16:59:01 -0800 2002 606022 0 Mike G 4 606035 There is also one of these new Maxwell Street outposts on 31st street, around 600W. I stood in a line of about 6 people, all of whom ordered the Polish with fries. I ordered the pork chop sandwich with fries (my mistake?) The sandwich was completely unremarkable-- I remember thinking that they hadn't even seasoned the chop with salt and pepper, otherwise I might have forgiven that it had been cooked to a leathery chewiness. I'll probably give it another chance, but I'll order the Polish. joel Sun Nov 17 23:47:36 -0800 2002 606026 0 joel 5 606037 There's also one on First Ave. in Maywood. Mon Nov 18 00:01:00 -0800 2002 606035 0 annieb 6 607279 While I have not had the pork chop sandwich at Damen and Diversey yet (though it kills me to pass it everyday), I have had it a several times over the past 20 years at is original location on Maxwell St. To me, there is nothing as satisfying as this sandwich. First, the overpowering smell of grilled onions that hangs in the air...*sigh*. Next comes the sheer giddiness of getting my grease soaked brown paper bag with not one but two pork chop sandwiches in it. Now, that first bite, which you so methodically must plan out (while driving, of course)...will it be all bite in to the bone or will actually get the pork chop right away. There is nothing like this wonderful "heart attack waiting to happen" sandwich. It has never failed to make me one happy woman and ensure my future place in an chicago ER room one day. Thu Dec 26 18:45:01 -0800 2002 606037 0 Jen 7 607289 Jen, If you can eat a pork chop sandwich loaded with grilled onion, dripping with grease and yellow mustard while driving you get my nod for Chowhound of the year. I need to take a shower from just eating one leaning over a counter, with a load of napkins at the ready. I know a guy who contends he is able to eat an Al's Italian beef with all the trimmings while driving. Not that I don’t believe him, but………… Enjoy, Gary Fri Dec 27 09:44:33 -0800 2002 607279 0 G Wiv 1 606024 I was just there 30 minutes ago. Enjoyed an airy, delightful alfajor, a spinach empanada (of four types on offer today) and a pastelillo de dulce de leche. Chatted a bit with the amiable owner. Noted that they have matambre as well. The people in line before me came all the way from Michigan to get their groceries. From his business card: Ramon Mario Gimenez Buenos Aires Liquor and Deli 3100 N. Cicero Avenue Tel: (773) 685-4241 buenosairesdeli.com (This is a block south of Belmont, on the west side of Cicero) Sun Nov 17 16:40:33 -0800 2002 606017 0 RST 2 606029 Incidentally, I am in the middle of a major hounding day. Started this morning at Asi Es Guerrero and had that blow-your-mind-away pozole verde (will add a note to the pozole verde thread below later tonight when I get home as it is not so far back), explored this whole North-Pulaski area (and found another restaurant with pozole verde), took the Pulaski bus north to Irving Park and rode west and then east and then west again, yo-yoing up and down the avenue all the way to Harlem. Took the Harlem bus down to Caputo's. Came back north to Belmont where I headed first to BA deli and then to Chicago Food Corp. (CTA tip to get to this Korean market: take the blue line to the Belmont stop and then walk 2 blocks north on Kimball). I am now at the public lib checking a few references re details. In half an hour, I will be down at Polo for dinner (and to squeeze out the owner's entire life history ;)) and then tonight, I will be at DOC to watch Jacques Rivette's Celine et Julie. On Pulaski, at around Armitage (?) there are 2 new places about to open: La Humita, a South-american restaurant of unknown origin and a certain Manee Thai. On the way to Asi Es Guerrero, saw a bit of the North Avenue Puerto-Rican district: am convinced that there MUST be a Dominican food-related business somewhere around here. ***** Could not make it to Cicero last weekend but managed to stop at La Quebrada on Roosevelt on Thursday for a quick lunch. (By the way, noted an interesting looking soul food place on Harrison called Doggy's) Was very impressed by the gordita de carne (rib eye) en chile de arbol. This is the true gordita, i.e. NOT two thick corn tortillas making up a kind of sandwich. It is a single thick corn tortilla "slit open" (just like pita bread) to form a kind of mitten/pocket. This is a technically perfect gordita: the 2 "walls" are thin and airy, the filling juicy and "wet" yet the whole thing did not break apart immediately. It took almost till I was half-way through the "pocket" before it started getting sloppy. It never ceases to astonish me that there are people out there who still do things the risky, painstaking way. Don't they know that they can make as much money doing gorditas just like everyone else? Must go back and try other things from here. RST Sun Nov 17 18:02:26 -0800 2002 606024 0 RST 3 606030 I saw Humitas served in Santiago, Chile. I understand they are more of a dish from the north, and are also eaten in Ecuador and Peru. They are in the tamale family. Did not eat them, as those escorting me around were big devotees of another use of a corn dough, pastel de choclo, which is a meat pie with corn dough on top. Quite good, in a plain Chilean food kind of way. Sun Nov 17 18:51:22 -0800 2002 606029 0 annieb 4 606031 Annie et al (y todos), How timely. Am going to Santiago and thereabouts for a week in two weeks. I know nothing more about the food than what I have read here and in guidebooks. Can you give me any direction, or point me to sources? thanks, d Sun Nov 17 20:07:17 -0800 2002 606030 0 dickson d 5 606036 Dickson, I only spent a week in Santiago proper. Here's my recollections and advice. By the way, I was there in November. You will see lots of fruit for sale from carts, huge piles of strawberries. Wash carefully, there are wastewater issues in the fields around Santiago. When I was there I was hosted by working class/middle class people so we ate modestly, a couple meals we went up a notch, we did better when off by ourselves. Natives trying to impress may try to impress you by sending you to a neighborhood called Bellavista, it's the "artsy" neighborhood, a combination of big beer gardens, tacky craft stalls ( a lot of the "craft stalls" in Santiago are filled with basically south asian imports, sort of old 60s style stuff, clothes and jewelry. On the craft end, look up a reputable guidebook "Cerro San Lucia" it's a delightful interlude in the middle of very crowded Santiago right up a little hill (it's kind of hidden, or unremarkable from the street) on the Avenida Bernardo O'Higgens. Inside is a craft market with very beautiful items, quiet and friendly and better prices I've heard than in the upscale parts of town. Across the street is the main craft market, delve deep into the back and you'll be liable to find more original designs of lapis jewelery (lapis and malachite are ubiquitous). A couple people who were at the same market as I was couldn't believe I bought things at the same market. On an even further aside, a real bargain at that market (and elsewhere in Santiago, like in the open air market on the mall near the Cathedral, if it hasn't been completely run out of business by the police yet) were very good quality fine art posters at a fraction of the price you can find them here, and a wider variety of some artists, like Diego Rivera. Feel free to bargain, and be put down a bit for bargaining if they catch on you're norteamericana (personally, I look totally gringa). Okay, on to the food. Chilean food, in my experience (limited by the above time and companioin constraints) is a large case of excellent ingredients in search of good cooks. I did not have anything bad, just a fair amount of bland food (not bad when you're spending a lot of time in a large conference hall with limited bathrooms and staying in a dormitory with shared bathrooms). Excellent fish. When we were there was shortly after the typhus (Thyphoid) incidents in Peru, so there was an issue around ceviche, more upscale places would make assurances that the fish was cooked/frozen or however it needed to be dealt with. I didn't pay much attention as I can't eat raw fish. There are a couple of very odd and highly prized local sea creatures, one looks for all the world like a whole roasted and peeled red pepper of the small jalapeno size. Came in both a very nice seafood stew and in a seafood salad. I'm sorry I can't remember the name, both times it had a pronounced flavor, hot was better. There is a wonderful old central market, great old wrought iron building, near the train station. The outside is ringed with street vendors, nothing too terribly interesting, but the inside has fresh fish vendors, beautiful displays of vegetables, and many many restaurants specializing in fish. Most have a display case showing the fish. A couple pointers: there are some nice ones on the floor of the market, a little pricier, ask to be seated away from the aisle or you will be accosted continuously and piteously by vendors. Admittedly, with me looking totally gringa and being there with a friend who is black Haitian, we really stood out, but others told us the same thing, even Argentinos, etc. If you need to eat someplace a little cheaper (but can be equally as good), look for someplace that has an upstairs and ask to be seated upstairs. The word will still get out that you're there, but it will mean 2 vendors in an hour instead of one every 5-8 minutes. We had one very good meal on the advice of someone who lived there at a more upscale place near one of the Universities (not Catholic U, more off the beaten track). Taxis are ubiquitous and cheap. We had one sort of expensive meal (actually just tapas) in a little place called something tasca in Bellavista, and another decent meal at a decent price in one of the many restaurants lining the main drag of that neighborhood. It was late at night, so we didn't go for it, but many of the restaurants along there advertise a big parillada if you like that kind of thing. Speaking of Haiti (forgive me, the Irish are a storytelling people) a big thing in Santiago are coffee bars, Cafe Haiti is one of the chains and serves very good espresso, cappucino, and excellent thick hot chocoloate. The big draw, however, are the waitresses, who are serving from a platform about 10 inches high behind a bar that is maybe 30 inches high, and in very short skirts, basically in heavy makeup and little french maid outfits. On all of the occasions I was taking a coffee, I was one of only a very few women (less than 5%) in the place, places were always packed. Cafe Haiti is pretty reputable, on side streets just a few steps a way are coffee bars where the coffee is supposed to be perfectly just as good, but they do things like the "minuto milionario" where for one minute every hour the waitresses take off their tops, apparently it makes it seem like you won the lottery. And a few blocks away near the train station..... A couple final things....avocado is called palta, readily available, especially in a standard sandwich called churrasco that is nothing like Brazilian churrasco, more like a Mexican torta with not so great beef, lots of avocado, probably butter or margarine on the bun, and tons of japanese style mayo on it. And I mean tons. Learn to say poco mayonesa. Beets, which I adore, were readily available, but are called betaraya instead of rebolacha. Have fun. Mon Nov 18 00:00:06 -0800 2002 606031 0 annieb 6 606041 Thanks Annie - very helpful. And stories were what I was looking for. Personal experiences. The coffee bars sound pretty bizarre, and a story worth telling. I am going with my brother just for fun, and while I can never tell where it looks like we come from, I know I will sound gringo. But maybe if I lead with my French... d Mon Nov 18 07:37:41 -0800 2002 606036 0 dickson d 7 606042 Bizaree as they are, and worthy of disapproval on some grounds, if you need coffee that is where to go, because in the rest of Chile, coffee means lukewarm water with Nescafe. I just made the audience my show, rather than the waitresses. Thanks. Mon Nov 18 07:57:29 -0800 2002 606041 0 annieb 7 606047 I know its more of a peruvian thing but what my wife loved from her visits to chile were pisco sours, and the wine of course. Mon Nov 18 09:43:12 -0800 2002 606041 0 zim 8 606080 Pisco is ubiquitous all over Santiago, and any good liquor store will have quite a variety, including some artisanal ones. Good thing to bring back. Finding a good wine store was more of a challenge, and it would pay to do some research, much of Chile is being overtaken with multinational wineries making international style wine. I went armed with a well-researched list to bring a few things for my husband (the wine guy) and once I did find a very good wine store in central Santiago, they were out of several things on my list. I should mention also that my list was quite specific as to year. Mon Nov 18 22:13:44 -0800 2002 606047 0 annieb 3 606046 Can I talk about La Quebrada enough? Well, you give me the opening. I've had that exacat same gordita, with lomo de arbol. I never realized that gorditas were supposed to be any other way than as made here, pocket style. Something similiar, but more unique is the picadita. Kind of like an open face gordita. They do not put meat in the picadita, so you really taste the masa. Finally, have I said before that I believe La Quebrada serves the BEST tortillas. I am of the school of thought that feels any handmade tortilla is something really good to eat, but I think that Quebrada is the first among equals. My theory is that the better tortilla comes from using the grill instead of the traditional comal. I believe (but am not positive) that the grill can be kept at a lower and more uniform tempature. This produces a tortilla a bit heavier and thicker, more like a pancake than a tortilla. I've wanted to ask this before, but what do people think of this as an etiquette question: As one is eating away, La Quebrada will re-fill the tortilla basket for you. If there are any tortillas leftover when leftovers are wrapped up, they toss them in the doggie bag. What my devilish side wants to do, is ask for a fresh basket of tortillas just before I know I'll be done, and then take them all home. Fair? VI Mon Nov 18 09:40:31 -0800 2002 606029 0 Vital Information 4 606075 Well, you cannot bullshit this at all. Either you have found the senora to do this kind of gordita or you don't. You cannot hire a high-school kid to throw it in the fryer for you. You cannot measure out the masa ahead of time. There is no way to standardize this kind of process. You absolutely need a senora who has been patting out tortillas all her life (and most of them start at 12 yrs of age or so) to be able to pinch off the exact quantity of masa (testal) every single time and pat out a pancake of the exact thickness so that the two "walls" will be exactly so, when it is opened up. If fact, you might need two or more senoras around. If your senora is suddenly incapacitated, you probably cannot just ask your grillman or anyone hanging out to pat out the same thing for you. This is a specialist profession/an artisanal specialization in the strictest sense of the word. Even in Mexico, it is not always possible to find someone capable of making this kind of gordita: this is why the double-tortilla gordita has become common coinage. Asi es Guerrero for instance makes an excellent version using two separate hand-patted tortillas. Their version is also notable for being "dragged through the garden" or should I say, "dragged through the garden (for lettuce and tomatos) AND creamery (for sour cream)". This form is specific to a certain part of Guerrero and I think the prototype (or one of the prototypes) not only of the lettuce/sourcream/shredded cheese-topped "Lincoln Park/Lakeview" taco, but of the stereotypical American taco in general. I think that Taco Bell now offers "gorditas" as well. I wonder which format they use: the pocket or sandwich? That is, I wonder which version they are promoting to the American public as the essential form. Of course, replicating a corn pocket should not be a problem for them as they can manufacture almost anything industrially. Just for the record, this gordita is $2.50. Just the quantity of meat-filling alone is worth more than $2.50. Doesn't it just simply break your heart to know that there are things out here in the city of such purity and such beauty that remain completely unrecognized bec people have been eating junk for so long they can no longer tell the true fom the false. Doesn't it make your blood boil that this country has been conned into accepting poorer degraded versions from California or Texas as "Mexican" cuisine? Doesn't it infuriate you that the Tribune and the food press in general keep listing enchilada-and-margarita joints (for instance, jokes like Tarascas) instead of searching out profounder forms? Isn't it absolutely ridiculous that any expressions of enthusiasm for such forms of "authenticity" and truth could be denounced as "reverse snobbery"? As to whether or not this is the best masa around is another question I will leave that for another thread. I am too weary and too battle-scarred at the moment to join in another debate. And, no, the comal is better. The grill is more consistent but the product of the comal is superior. RST (posted something earlier this p.m. in the pozole verde thread) Mon Nov 18 18:13:27 -0800 2002 606046 0 RST