111594 Thu Oct 17 00:24:48 -0700 2002 20 7 Chicago Area 0 604543 At dinner tonight, the chowhounditas were regaling me with all that is de-gus-TING at school lunch. Top on their list was salisbury steak. Now, maybe I am far enough removed from my school days, or perhaps I am in a fit of nostalgia, but suddenly tonight, I am craving salisbury steak. Ms. VI checked her vast array of cook books and came up with NO recipes. I had smugly grabbed the Joy of Cooking, saying I'd find one, only to be rebuffed there as well (there are recipes however for sloppy joes and swiss steak in JoC). I did later find a few recipes on the TVFoodnetwork site, including an Emerilized version. They seem like a lot of work. So, is there any place, beside your kids cafeteria to get a GOOD slab of salisbury steak? By the way, in the course of my searches tonight, I learned that Dr. Salisbury whom the steak is named after, was like the Atkins of his day (ca. late 1800's). Salisbury steak was his way of getting people to eat a bit more protein. Thu Oct 17 00:24:48 -0700 2002 0 Vital Information 1 604548 Denny's? Thu Oct 17 08:59:40 -0700 2002 604543 0 Old School 2 604551 Did your researches include the July/August Saveur, where (in an article on hamburgers-- no it doesn't use the term "30s style" though it does credit Wichita's central role in burger history) it says: "Circa 1888, James Henry Salisbury, a British physician, proposed simply seasoned ground beef, eaten three times a day, as a specific against anemia, colitis, tuberculosis, and other ailments. (Much later, salisbury steak came to mean a fancified ground beef patty, often oval in shape, served without a bun but usually with a brown sauce or at least a sprinkling of parsley in upscale American or 'Continental' restaurants." I think the clue this paragraph offers is that the salisbury steak is so basic-- brown gravy being an utterly common item back then-- that there's no point in offering a recipe for a ground beef patty with brown gravy on it-- it'd be like a recipe for toast with jam. Thu Oct 17 09:38:19 -0700 2002 604548 0 Mike G 3 604555 What is interesting about Salisbury steak and its connection to early high protein diets is that, based on the few recipes I have seen, a key element in salisbury steak is the combination of non-meat ingredients with the meat. The recipes all call for the adding of minced or ground onions to the meat. Bread crumbs are also added in one recipe. So, the notion of Salisbury steak is not just one of hamburger steak with brown mushroom gravy, but hamburger enhanced with various ingredients AND THEN drenched in gravy. Just to continue on the this for a moment. One recipe called for the meat to be broiled and the sauce to be laddled on after the cooking, the other recipe called for the meat and the sauce to be baked together. So, if I do go the make it myself route, I will need advice on which approach to take. Thu Oct 17 10:14:51 -0700 2002 604551 0 Vital Information 4 604559 I don't have access to my recipes right now because I'm at work. I seem to recall seeing on in either Betty Crocker or Better Homes and Gardens that was decent. All recipes I've seen for Salisbury steak involve blending "other" ingredients to assist in binding the meat. Bread crumbs, eggs, onions are different variations. My vote is for broiling first. You can get some good texture and color on the meat. Grilling outside would be a decent alternative. Cooking them together is just inviting a greasy gravy....not chowhoundish, IMO. You could simmer together briefly before serving to marry the flavors a bit. Thu Oct 17 10:21:37 -0700 2002 604555 0 DeeS. 4 604566 O.K Rob heres some help. Basically salisbury steak is much like meatloaf, with a brown or mushroom gravy. Broiling and adding the sauce will be dry baking with the sauce will be moister but may not leave a lot of sauce. My recommendation, bake as meatloaf, but in oval patty shapes. Add onion if you wish, breadcrumbs and an egg. I have seen recipes that may add milk as a liquid, you can also add some broth or ketchup or tomato juice as a flavor ingredient. Since they are essentially baked patties they need not cook as long as meatloaf, probably about 30 minutes in a 350 degree oven. Any further questions call. Ma Thu Oct 17 10:40:33 -0700 2002 604555 0 Paulette 4 604569 My Fannie Farmer (copyright 1959) says to broil hamburger patties with no additives, and serve with brown gravy or mushroom gravy, with a sprinkling of parsley. Sounds great, you can even cook it rare! If you compare that to the type which is full of fillers and add-ins, and simmered in gravy, then imaging taking that one step further, you will have what we hate from our childhood cafeteria days: mystery meat which tastes and looks like dog food, served in a puddle of brownish salty goo. Thu Oct 17 10:50:15 -0700 2002 604555 0 ironmom 4 604590 Although I also think it was the Victorian style to make anything with a lot of binders and stretchers like eggs and bread crumb and, probably, all sorts of suety type things we wouldn't touch now. It was a time when people had both less money and less teeth, so they wanted every part of the cow ground together into an easily gummed goo. Thu Oct 17 15:41:45 -0700 2002 604555 0 Mike G 4 604627 Rob, I'm a bake/broil separately guy because the end result is a cleaner dish. The patties give off some fat and coagulated protein/foam type stuff as they cook, and by cooking them separately, you avoid getting all that stuff in your sauce. Blot the patties on paper towels after cooking and add to your sauce. If you want to upgrade it to the next level, go to Paulina market for a chunk of their frozen veal demi glace (good price). Saute some mushrooms, deglaze with madiera or marsala, melt down some demi to create your sauce. All you then need is lots of creamy mashed potatoes, and some good crusty bread for soppin'. Fri Oct 18 02:54:06 -0700 2002 604555 0 Ron Rosenbaum 1 604558 VI, Just called George's. They have Salisbury steak as a special, every Monday, $6.75. George’s 145 South Oak Park Avenue Oak Park, IL (708-848-4949) Thu Oct 17 10:21:07 -0700 2002 604543 0 David C. Hammond 2 604563 Do we have a date? Thu Oct 17 10:34:19 -0700 2002 604558 0 Vital Information 3 604572 Sounds good. Lunch? Anyone else interested in the gustatory adventure, this step into the culinary timewarp to sample Dr. Salisbury's version of "health food"? Thu Oct 17 11:07:44 -0700 2002 604563 0 David C. Hammond 4 604576 Not everyone is young, rich and idle, able to trip off to fantastic, far-flung hotspots at a moment's whim. Thu Oct 17 12:04:30 -0700 2002 604572 0 Harry V. 5 604673 So how was it? Did it live up to your neo-Victorian hopes? Fri Oct 18 19:33:58 -0700 2002 604576 0 Mike G 1 604560 It's so funny that you bring this up. The other night my spouse made salisbury steak--a first--because he'd just acquired Rachel Ray's Comfort Food and it contained the recipe. It seems like a terrific cookbook (30 minute meals). I commented at the time that I thought salisbury steak was something you tried to avoid in your high school cafeteria, but he remembers it as a treat, for some reason. Anyway, it was actually delicious! Thu Oct 17 10:24:10 -0700 2002 604543 0 susanb 2 604587 Rachel Ray is probably my favorite foodtv person besides Alton Brown.. I don't think it has anything to do with her food, but rather just with her unbelievably bubbly personality. It's a terrible way to judge someone's cooking, but when they're *that* enthusiastic about it all, it's hard not to like it. And, of course, her recipes are usually much more geared towards the home cook than emeril's or bobby flay's. I'll also recommend alton browns "food + heat = cooking" book.. I believe it also has a salisbury steak recipe, and knowing AB it'll be simple and tasty. -Ed Thu Oct 17 15:08:54 -0700 2002 604560 0 Ed Fisher 3 604604 Makes one long for David Rosengarten's "Taste" that aired of in the early days of Food Network. I was always amazed that in a 30 minute segment, Rosengarten, could not only give you the history of and a great recipe for something as simple as Salisbury steak. But, he'd take extra care to find a wine that went well with it. No screaming. No cheering. Just good cooking. Thu Oct 17 17:07:26 -0700 2002 604587 0 YourPalWill 4 604609 Hear hear. Mr. Rosengarten's show "Taste" was a great favorite of mine. Serious but not stuffy, enthusiastic but not witless. Why won't the Food Network repeat episodes of that fine show any more? Instead Food TV seem to be having a competition with itself to discover and promote the most odious personalities in broadcasting. I continue to marvel that anyone can watch shows featuring Alton Brown or Jamie Oliver without nausea. At least they give us the witty, trenchant and stylish Anthony Bourdain. Thu Oct 17 19:13:12 -0700 2002 604604 0 Harry V. 5 604610 I agree with you about Dave Rosegarten - my husband and I still miss him - although we have no problem with Alton or Jamie. Many of the good shows seem to have gone by the wayside to give way to silliness. We used to enjoy Emeril much more until he got so silly - or maybe they made him be that way. Thanks for listening! Thu Oct 17 21:06:56 -0700 2002 604609 0 Donna - MI 6 605086 A few weeks ago I saw an old episode of Julia Child's show which featured a very young Emeril as the guest chef. He was earnest, enthusiastic and almost nervous looking. It was great. So much better than the persona now seen splattered all over the airwaves. Fri Oct 25 14:45:14 -0700 2002 604610 0 Schatz MacArthur 7 605110 I've seen that one too. Julia and Emeril are very fond of each other. D. Fri Oct 25 23:53:14 -0700 2002 605086 0 Donna - MI